So, you went back to Islam, huh Paul? For several months in 2021 you indicated that you had left Islam again (for the 4th or 5th or 6th time in recent years) – I lost track.
What about the humorous Monty Python type video you put up on your blog, the clay motion stop rats comedy, using Ali Dawa and his statement of being proud of Islamic law that they will kill apostates in Islamic lands, (on your blog here, August 18, 2020) , etc. – that demonstrates the brutality and evil of Islamic law? (kill the infidels, etc. (both Qur’an and Hadith); and “whoever leaves his Islamic religion, kill him” (Hadith) ?
The irony of the rat clay motion animation is that the content of the speech by Ali Dawa is ominous and evil; but the form of putting it in the cartoons of rats is very very funny.
Do you now repudiate all of that ? You seemed to recognize the problems within Islam itself for a while, but now seem to have gone back to it. (along with your other recent videos at your You Tube channel)
I testify that there is only One God; there is no god except the Living God, the God of the Bible, the Sovereign Creator, the Holy Trinity, One in substance / nature / essence, in three divine eternal persons; that is, the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit; and Jesus Christ is the eternal Son / eternal Word (John 1:1; 17:5; Philippians 2:5-8).
Jesus Al Masih is the Kalimat’ Allah and a Spirit from Allah.
there are two persons in John 1:1 -“and the Word was with God” = the Son was with the Father in eternity past. Two of the three persons of the Trinity.
But there is only one God by nature / substance / essence. (The Word was God)
Your misled Kenny …lol… if there are two distinct persons that each share the same divine nature / substance / essence then your a polytheist who believes in two distinct personal divine gods not one god lol….
The One God of Israel in the Bible is a personal divine deity, not some substance or essence that is shared in persons lol…
Show one instance where the One True God of the Bible denotes a divine nature / substance / essence?
That is what John 1:1-5 and Philipiians 2:5-8 and Hebrews 1:3, 6, 8, 10-12 and John 20:28; John 5:17-18; John 10:30 and Romans 9:5 and Colossians 1:15-20 means.
They all mean that = One God in substance / essence / nature and, with the passages with the Holy Spirit, 3 in person.
John 14
John 15:26
John 16
Matthew 28:19 – baptism in the name (one) of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit ( 3 persons)
2 Cor. 13:14 – the love of God (the Father), the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ (the Son) and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit.
None of these verses you’ve referenced, whether individually or collectively, biblically mean or denote the One God is a divine substance/nature/essence that is shared amongst 3 distinct persons lol… š
Your delusional misunderstanding and eisegesis of these verses are a reflection of your trinitarian misguidance, where your implied meaning > “One God in substance / essence / nature and, with the passages with the Holy Spirit, 3 in person” only exists in your mind wondering in a maze, not in these NT texts
Kenny, you worship three distinct personal divine gods that all share the same divine substance/essence/nature … 3 divine gods Kenny š not the personal divine One God of Israel
Notice how the Quran shouts out on every page about the Absolute ONENESS of GOD WHO has no partners. Then I imagine Mr. Temple can bring forth at least 10 or 12 verses showing his own personal beliefs.
Not quite the big shout out is it?
I mean, with this awesome knowledge, one would think that it would be the backbone of what would go on to be called Christianity. But it appears that a couple of centuries of arguing about the nature of Christ took place. In Islam, I imagine, the argument would last about 10 seconds or less! Probably less!!!
The Gospel of Mark calls this man (see chap. 3 Acts) Rabbi. When a person eventually gets to meet his LORD, will he call him ‘Hey You’!
If you can do it (that is a big IF) go to islamtheway.org and review my last 25 articles or so and you will get some very stark understanding of Jesus (pbh) the Incarnate Word! And when you get around to viewing Micah chapter 5? calling this soul very ancient and related in some sense to David (pbh) know that the word ancient means a construct being bracketted by time. In other words, there was a time he did not exist and a time when he was brought into existance. Brought into existance by his CREATOR!
Interesting that Paul Williams got rid of his post about Ali Dawah’s death wish with the animation clay-mation stop rats with Ali Dawah’s voice in one of the rats & of the rats eating the Qur’an. no longer there. Interesting.
Yes, the doctrine of the Trinity is the backbone of Christianity – Protestants, Roman Catholics, Eastern Orthodoxy, Coptic Church and other Miaphysites, and Assyrian Church of the East all agree on the Trinity.
They all agree on the Nicene Creed and the Nicene-Constantinoplitan Creed (the 2 councils of 325 AD and 381 AD.
Protestants believe the doctrine comes from the Bible as the root and source and infallible, and the doctrine is confirmed by these councils.
You get the picture! That is one reason why I went from being Roman Catholic to Islam! And I suppose that is why you are you! I rest on the credentials of all the prophets sent by their LORD. From THEIR MOUTHS and not from my own personal interpretation! There is NO compulsion in relgion. If the LIGHT is there and comes into the heart then that is fine. I don’t have any control over that. If it doesn’t then that is fine also because that was decided by the ONE WHO KNOWS.
Feel free to follow your GOD or gods or whatever the case may be. But I rejoice in the Incarnate Word or should I say reincarnated Word who came often to mankind for their benefit especially the Children of Israel and thus as he said ‘how often he would have been like a mother hen with her chicks but ye would not. And GOD is no fool to be manipulated like an ordinary piece from a game of checkers.
We have that knowledge in the Quran and Old and New Testaments but like in all things, one cannot read but only what one’s heart can see.
I say it all on my website islamtheway.org. Is not Jesus (pbh) the vine and THE GOD the VINEDRESSER? And what properties in him that were not good was pruned out of him but what properties GOD liked were multiplied in him according to the Gospel of John!
How can something be weaned out from someone who is born perfect? NO! He must come and learn like any man and be ‘straightened’ along the way! Although I don’t claim him to be ADAM, I just claim him to be our adam born to the flesh some 50,000 years ago or in that range as ALLAH WILLS. That knowledge would have to be understood from Ibn ‘Abbas and his comment on one of the verses in the Quran about the 7 Heavens and 7 Earths found in the Tafsir of Suyuti. And of course a lot more than this especially in the Quranic verse of announcing the simlitude of Jesus before ALLAH is like that of Adam. – LINE UPON LINE, STEP BY STEP, HERE A LITTLE, THERE A LITTLE or if you prefer saying it another way, then you will surely travel stage by stage (Quran). YOU SHOULD KNOW THAT A ROSE BY ANY OTHER NAME SMELLS JUST AS SWEET!
Did not father Abraham (pbh) rejoice to see his day and SAW IT! That day that his varied trials were not in vain and that he became that ‘chosen one’ to be what we call our Messiah! Praise be to ALLAH WHOSE PLAN IS PERFECT!!!
Jesus is the vine and the Father is the vinedresser – John 15:1
This shows that Modalism is wrong. (that the Father became Jesus for a time and then the Father became the Spirit) John 15:1 shows 2 of the persons of the Tri-personal Trinity.
It’s like being on a Ferris Wheel as the arguement keeps going round and round. You stated what I said was against Islam. How very interesting that you hold court on me with your knowledge, scanty as it may be, about Islam. But what do I see from your writing but a shout out to councils and someone hard pressed to talk about the words used by Jesus (pbh). I am affraid there is no cure for cognitive dissonance that I can offer. So, go in peace and keep pressing to find the Universal GOD.
Interesting that Paul Williams got rid of his post about Ali Dawahās death wish (on apostates and agreement with Sharia law that apostates should be killed in Islamic lands) with the animation clay-mation stop rats with Ali Dawahās voice in one of the rats & of the rats eating the Qurāan. no longer there. Interesting.
Jordan Peterson (the famous Canadian psychologist) asked Muhammad Hijab, after M. Hijab chanted some of the Qur’an to him:
“What good does that do for someone like me?” ( who does not understand it?”)
Peterson also very clearly called Muhammad the prophet of Islam a “war-lord” who inspired the early Caliphs to conquer and subjugate by aggressive expansionist war.
The part that Hijab chanted was Surah 59:22-23
Two of the Arabic terms for Allah are:
Al Jabbar – the one who forces, compels – used of human tyrants – they called Saddam Hussein, Moamar Qaddafi, Hafez Al Assad – Jabbar – tyrants, dictators
and
Al Motakabir – the arrogant one; proud one.
J. Peterson pointed out that the Christian tradition has “turn the other cheek” and “don’t take vengeance and revenge”
When the well is poisoned, the water will kill! In short dear Ken or Kennith, I’m a Muslim not because I wanted to be haughty or arrogant but because I wanted to get out from under that stuff! And besides, with a map refferencing the area called Kush or Cush of 650 BC or there abouts and knowing something about Islam, I put the the book of Zephania to the test (Chapter 3 verses 9 and 10). Here is what I found out:
Zephaniah Chapter 3 verses 9-10
The use of the symbols { } is for clarification purposes only.
Without a doubt it {The Quran} is (announced) in the {previous} revealed Books of {the} former peoples. Q (26: 196)
Zephaniah 3: 9-10 (New International Version)
Then I will purify the lips of the peoples, that all of them may call on the name of the LORD and serve him shoulder to shoulder.
From beyond the rivers of Cush my worshipers, my scattered people {Gentiles}, will bring ME offerings.
Zephaniah 3: 9-10 (21st Century King James Version)
For then will I return to the people a pure language that they may all call upon the name of the LORD, to serve HIM with one accord.
From beyond the rivers of Ethiopia MY suppliants–even the daughter of MY dispersed–shall bring MINE offering.
The Book of Zephaniah, which is a prophetical book discussing somewhat the approach of the ‘Judgment’, was originally written sometime in the 6th century BC although some scholars prefer a second century BC offering possibly borrowing on the originality of a manuscript from the 6th century BC. Whatever the truth of this matter, practically that amounts to about the same thing if the texts were followed in earnest.
It is clear and unambiguous that The GIVER of the āgiftā being spoken about comes directly from THE ONE LORD (GOD) and not something that drops into a manās head by his own doing. In other words, the gift that will be given is from GOD and directly from HIM and no other. This GIFT is mentioned as purified lips or a pure language and for a very good reason.
Verse number 9 talks of purified lips of the peoples or a pure language. When a person talks about using the lips of peoples, one is talking about a manner of speech and when one talks about a manner of speech; one is talking about a certain language that will be used.
Among humanity there is NO KNOWN pure language that has ever been invented by the hands of man. There has NEVER been a common language that has ever remained pure because like man, language that is developed from a creature (man) is like that creature ā changing.
The Eskimo living in his environment has perhaps over a hundred words for snow but people living in the desert may only have one or two words for this phenomenon.
So language reflects the utility of manās āchanging worldā and hence the language changes ā meaning that it does not remain pure but becomes adulterated according to need. Hence, the expression āI am badā can actually mean that I am good in the same language.
So at least we know that there will be a language involved instead of tap dancing. This language has to be a SPECIAL LANGUAGE and not anything that man could think of because it will have the property of being PURE and REMAINING PURE and that will be quite a feat due to manās proclivity in messing things up!
Moreover, we cannot forget that this language will be DIRECTLY from the ONE GOD and who would ever attribute to HIM imperfection but one who is deformed in the soul.
Also, the language cannot be common everyday speech because that would also get messed up by being morphed into many dialects. Rather the language must be very special AND EVEN CEREMONIAL for it to be ālocked upā and kept pure and unsullied by the hands of men.
The type of ceremonial expressions used must not be looked upon as a run of the mill experience like joining a club but rather put into an EXALTED POSITION to merit such a stance as being pure and kept pure.
There is only one logical form of highest thought taken by most men from the past to the present and that is the form of RELIGION AND RELIGIOUS EXPRESION. Hence, this protected language which is PURE and going to remain PURE is a Religious Language.
From so-called shamans to tribal chiefs or witch doctors, there is shown a way of ātalkingā to the āhigher powersā in that particular culture. The highest known symbolic discourse between man and the POWER WHO created him comes from religion and not astronomy or a study in arts and crafts.
Being a Religious Language that remains PURE cannot be for one person or for one country and as the verses claim, which is fairly easy to figure out, this language will be for various peoples WHO PRACTICE this form of worship or belief system.
A pure language like rituals will change over a period of time UNLESS of course it is in a form that a person can say and remember that it becomes the proverbial āwritten in stoneā language or a language unaltered through time.
Jesus (pbh), for example, spoke a form of Aramaic called Syriac but we do not connect with the knowledge of what he declared in that language. Basically, his language has gone through the ātreadmillā of Greek, Latin, English and whatever other language which would alter the meanings even very minutely but still they would be altered.
In other words, this PURE LANGUAGE may be spoken but it has to be PRESERVED AND REVERED such that it is in a written form that can be used as a STANDARD for checking the veracity of the spoken form or written forms coming from it and so highly thought of that any attempt to fool around with it will bring ādire consequencesā.
Hence, this written form must be duplicated in great quantities for the peoples and thusly can be easily checked out as to its maintaining its āperfectionā.
So a RECORD of the formation, development, delivery of this language has to be kept as from the beginning of its origins so as to be able to show that it has a track record of purity and not just some kind of fairytale story as an invisible book kept by and controlled by high priests.
Therefore, the best form of preservation is an actual book by which a standard can be formed to test any copies that would be made of this book or recitations given from this book.
Because we are looking at a āBookā or widespread record of some kind, the matter becomes simple. Thinking that only one book spread around many countries will fit the bill is ludicrous. Therefore, each territory or, in this case, each place of CEREMONIAL WORSHIP must have an exact duplicate of the original.
And if that ārecordā or book was to be used in individual houses, which the Quran is, it would have to remain pure and not have any alteration done on it and go undetected when challenged and still be classified as being pure.
Of course any person can alter the Quran personally but it would NOT BE ACCEPTED across communities when āput under the microscopeā and tested.
The conclusion is simple. A BOOK must exist that is GOD GIVEN and it is and fully REMAINS AVAILABLE in its ORIGINAL LANGUAGE (not just a translated form as the verses from the two of the above Old Testament translated sources are)!
Well if it is a GOD GIVEN BOOK it will be about the guidance given to man rather than instructions on how to perform tap dancing and this makes it a religious book which in turn makes it a TESTAMENT and that, in turn, makes it A SEPERATE PHASE OR FORM OF RELIGION as shown in the following verse from the New Testament.
Where there is a NEW TESTAMENT GIVEN there is a paradigm change. This means that in the common language of man there will come a NEW RELIGION. This does not mean that the religion is brand spanking new but it is NOT going to be just a carbon copy of the preceding religion even though it may harmonize with the older testament for truths shall be revealed and lies will be uncovered!
{For where a testament is {paradigm change}, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator Heb. (9: 16).}
Jesus (pbh) didnāt ādieā a physical, total journey ending in death and bodily decay as āTHE DEATHā or the completion of his sojourn but, according to Islam, he WILL RETURN to lead the Islamic kingdom on Earth and after marriage and several decades will die and be buried (with the rich ā Isaiah Chapter 53) with Prophet Muhammad (pbh) ā and they will raise up together.
Prophet Muhammad (pbh) DID DIE, however, and according to the New Testament, the PHYSICAL, COMPLETE DEATH is part of the proof of formation of an actual Religious Testament. Hence, the REALITY OF ISLAM according to this verse in the New Testament!
Worshiping with āone accordā can have many different meanings.
When one comes across a puzzler like this, one has to fit something in that will be in agreement with those two verses thus making the whole of the verses to harmonize without any contradiction. In other words, one takes that meaning that will not throw off the other meanings given in those two verses.
One can worship with one accord even though we are different as a people if that religion has a basis for belief (a basic, UNIFYING DOCTRINE) that ALL MEMBERS harmoniously believe in.
In other words, the basis of belief must be such that the upholders of that belief system understand that system no matter to what various cultures they are found in. That would be the FIVE PILLARS OF ISLAM forming the basis of that belief system or the bedrock as its foundation amongst those who believe.
āBy all of its worshipersā would mean from pole to pole and ocean to ocean such that THIS RELIGION would be a āWORLDWIDE RELIGION’ and NOT just for one city or country and that the true followers of that ONE RELIGION would follow the SAME HOLY BOOK without additional words or chapters thrown in or taken out ā unlike the Catholic Bible versus the Protestant Bible which has a different number of books in its canon ā and practice the same FIVE PILLARS.
The part about standing āshoulder to shoulderā can mean many things but it is the practice of Muslims to stand harmoniously and willingly in one accord during one of the essential pillars of faith and that is prayer ā for the prayer to be accepted ā men with men and women with women standing in straight line necessitating that they line up ‘shoulder to shoulder’!
Besides the above explanation, how can we know that Islam is being discussed in these two verses from Zephaniah? That is easy for we have the geographical location given. A religion starts descending from āaboveā through inspiration to those below. In other words, it has to have a physical presence and start from some place upon someone.
So, in this case we need to have a geographical area to deal with at the very start of this revelation. So it is easy to see that a prophet will be involved and he will be speaking to some people in the beginning and these people will have a home base or be domiciled in some geographical area.
The geographical area will be defined according to these verses based on the nature of the rivers found in the country mentioned. The country mentioned is that area of Cush or what is now known as Ethiopia.
The rivers in Ethiopia may run in a north-south or south-north direction. Therefore, one must go ACROSS from these rivers in an east-west direction to find the location of any religion that emerged from the time of the writing of this book called Zephaniah.
If one was to use willy-nilly logic and jump up or down going in a north or south direction in a random way by leapfrogging so many countries, then one could look for a religious movement with a preserved HOLY LANGUAGE coming from the north or south poles. However, when one restricts the search for this religion by going directly east or west from āacross the rivers of Ethiopiaā then one must look for that religion in those areas.
By going west from the rivers of Ethiopia one can keep going through the continent of Africa until one hits the Atlantic Ocean and NOT find any world-wide religion that can lay a claim for the fulfillment of the prophecy found in Zephaniah.
However, when one goes to the east from the rivers of Ethiopia, one does find an ESTABLISHED WORLD RELIGION WITH NEARLY A BILLION AND A HALF PEOPLE THAT FULLFILLS ALL OF THAT PROPHECY FOUND IN THE BOOK OF ZEPHANIAH and this country turns out to be Arabia specifically starting in the area called Makkah.
What about the ādispersed or scattered peopleā?
The original Children of Israel tended to be tribal and not such a propagating religious movement. Their original language varies with the times and their original records are somewhat suspect due to the various inabilities to keep alive their documents throughout history ā varied translations, yes but originals, NO!
The other branch of this ātribe,ā commonly called Christians today, do tend to be propagating as to their faith BUT DO NOT PRESENT EITHER A PURE LANGUAGE KEPT IN BOOK FORM OR A UNIFORM WAY OF WORSHIP!
That is, SOME Testament is used in a foreign-based language (Greek) or many kinds of translations making it easier for people to read and some form of creed is generally believed in but variations as to prayer, times of prayer, rituals and doctrine are quite varied and that is extremely important.
These thoughts may be taken as a form of nitpicking but what does the word āPUREā mean? Does it mean almost pure or does it imply 100% retrievable and provable pure? The verses in Zephaniah refer to the 100% form of purity not in custom but in the Language Guaranteed and Protected by the CREATOR LORD HIMSELF!
So the dispersed and scattered people would be people covering A WIDE AREA that would have been left out of the equation for salvation or those reduced to following some form of tribal paganism or even a strange philosophy (man as a GOD) as many of the Christians declare. There is another thought to this, however.
Considering the New Testament and its warnings of the ādeterioration of the truthā brought by Jesus (pbh) {refer to the scriptural sayings concerning the Spirit of truth found in the Dead Sea Scrolls and the Gospel of John) and what also is found in the Quran (Q 5: 14)}, one can gather that the floundering ship of truth must be resurrected with a PURE form of truth.
Otherwise, bringing oneās corrupted āofferingsā needs no PURE LANGUAGE or TRUTH to be sent down from the heavens when corruption will suffice or trump REALITY and that the ONE GOD will accept any old trash or falsehoods created by man to be thrown up to honor HIM!
It must be admitted that even a slow minded worshiper of any religion would be completely foolish as to confront the ONE GOD by proclaiming that HIS GIFT of a PURE LANGUAGE is foolish, misplaced or erroneous IF THAT PERSON HAS ANY HOPE OF A SUCCESSFUL FUTURE AFTERLIFE.
Without a doubt it {The Quran} is (announced) in the {previous} revealed Books of {the} former peoples {Jews/Christians}. Q (26: 196)
Praise be to ALLAH, WHO has sent to HIS Servant The BOOK {The Quran} and has allowed THEREIN NO CROOKEDNESS. Q (18: 1)
And remember ALLAH took a Covenant from the People of the Book {JEWS AND CHRISTIANS} to make it KNOWN and CLEAR to mankind and NOT to hide it {WHAT IT CONTAINED ABOUT THE COMING OF THE PROPHET OF TRUTH}; but they threw it away behind their backs and purchased with it some miserable gain! And vile was the bargain they made! Q (3: 187)
ALSO:
For those, too, who call themselves Christians, WE did take a Covenant, but they forgot a good part of the Message that was sent to them: So WE stirred up enmity and hatred between one and the other {to fight and squabble amongst themselves}, to the Day of Judgment. And soon will ALLAH show them what it is they have done. Q (5: 14)
Those who reject ALLAH {THE ONE AND ETERNAL GOD} and hinder (men) from the PATH of ALLAH, their deeds will ALLAH bring to naught {NOT ACCEPT THEIR DEEDS}. Q (47: 1)
HOWEVER:
WHOEVER {amongst the various religious peoples} goes right, then he goes right only for the benefit of his OWN SELF. And whoever goes astray, then he goes astray to his OWN LOSS. No one laden with burdens can bear another’s burden. And WE never punish until WE have sent a Messenger (to give warning). Quran 17:15
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7cPRqmZGskk
So, you went back to Islam, huh Paul? For several months in 2021 you indicated that you had left Islam again (for the 4th or 5th or 6th time in recent years) – I lost track.
What about the humorous Monty Python type video you put up on your blog, the clay motion stop rats comedy, using Ali Dawa and his statement of being proud of Islamic law that they will kill apostates in Islamic lands, (on your blog here, August 18, 2020) , etc. – that demonstrates the brutality and evil of Islamic law? (kill the infidels, etc. (both Qur’an and Hadith); and “whoever leaves his Islamic religion, kill him” (Hadith) ?
The irony of the rat clay motion animation is that the content of the speech by Ali Dawa is ominous and evil; but the form of putting it in the cartoons of rats is very very funny.
Do you now repudiate all of that ? You seemed to recognize the problems within Islam itself for a while, but now seem to have gone back to it. (along with your other recent videos at your You Tube channel)
Sorry, for several months in 2020, I guess. hard to keep track of all that you do; since I don’t frequent your blog anymore.
Ken are you ready to take sahada?
Lol come on Kenny… obey Jesus “Jesus declared. āFor it is written: āWorship the Lord your God and serve Him only.āāÆā… š
“One of those days Jesus went out to a mountainside to pray, and spent the night praying to God” š
I testify that there is only One God; there is no god except the Living God, the God of the Bible, the Sovereign Creator, the Holy Trinity, One in substance / nature / essence, in three divine eternal persons; that is, the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit; and Jesus Christ is the eternal Son / eternal Word (John 1:1; 17:5; Philippians 2:5-8).
Jesus Al Masih is the Kalimat’ Allah and a Spirit from Allah.
There are 2 gods in John 1:1
The rat clay stop motion animation using Ali Dawa’s speech of being proud of the death penalty in Islamic lands:
https://bloggingtheology.com/2020/08/18/ali-dawah-death-wish-to-the-apostate-prophet-and-kill-all-apostates/
“One of those days Jesus went out to a mountainside to pray, and spent the night praying to God” š
Of course, while on earth, Jesus prayed to the Father in heaven.
basic Christian theology 101
there are two persons in John 1:1 -“and the Word was with God” = the Son was with the Father in eternity past. Two of the three persons of the Trinity.
But there is only one God by nature / substance / essence. (The Word was God)
The Word = The Son = Jesus = God
The Father = God
In the beginning THE GOD WITH THE GOD = 2 GODS
LOl… š precisely right
No, John 1:1 demonstrates 2 persons(Father and Son/Word), of the 3 persons of the One True God, the Holy Trinity (Father, Son, and Holy Spirit)
The Word was with God – personal relationship
The Word was God (by nature and substance)
Matthew 28:19 – 3 persons
2 Cor. 13:14 – 3 persons
Yes, John 1:1 demonstrates 2 Gods
The Word (Jesus) was with God (The Father)
The Word (Jesus) was God
There are 2 Gods from very beginning.
Your misled Kenny …lol… if there are two distinct persons that each share the same divine nature / substance / essence then your a polytheist who believes in two distinct personal divine gods not one god lol….
The One God of Israel in the Bible is a personal divine deity, not some substance or essence that is shared in persons lol…
Show one instance where the One True God of the Bible denotes a divine nature / substance / essence?
That is what John 1:1-5 and Philipiians 2:5-8 and Hebrews 1:3, 6, 8, 10-12 and John 20:28; John 5:17-18; John 10:30 and Romans 9:5 and Colossians 1:15-20 means.
They all mean that = One God in substance / essence / nature and, with the passages with the Holy Spirit, 3 in person.
John 14
John 15:26
John 16
Matthew 28:19 – baptism in the name (one) of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit ( 3 persons)
2 Cor. 13:14 – the love of God (the Father), the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ (the Son) and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit.
Nope, Your misled Kenny…..
None of these verses you’ve referenced, whether individually or collectively, biblically mean or denote the One God is a divine substance/nature/essence that is shared amongst 3 distinct persons lol… š
Your delusional misunderstanding and eisegesis of these verses are a reflection of your trinitarian misguidance, where your implied meaning > “One God in substance / essence / nature and, with the passages with the Holy Spirit, 3 in person” only exists in your mind wondering in a maze, not in these NT texts
Kenny, you worship three distinct personal divine gods that all share the same divine substance/essence/nature … 3 divine gods Kenny š not the personal divine One God of Israel
Notice how the Quran shouts out on every page about the Absolute ONENESS of GOD WHO has no partners. Then I imagine Mr. Temple can bring forth at least 10 or 12 verses showing his own personal beliefs.
Not quite the big shout out is it?
I mean, with this awesome knowledge, one would think that it would be the backbone of what would go on to be called Christianity. But it appears that a couple of centuries of arguing about the nature of Christ took place. In Islam, I imagine, the argument would last about 10 seconds or less! Probably less!!!
The Gospel of Mark calls this man (see chap. 3 Acts) Rabbi. When a person eventually gets to meet his LORD, will he call him ‘Hey You’!
If you can do it (that is a big IF) go to islamtheway.org and review my last 25 articles or so and you will get some very stark understanding of Jesus (pbh) the Incarnate Word! And when you get around to viewing Micah chapter 5? calling this soul very ancient and related in some sense to David (pbh) know that the word ancient means a construct being bracketted by time. In other words, there was a time he did not exist and a time when he was brought into existance. Brought into existance by his CREATOR!
Interesting that Paul Williams got rid of his post about Ali Dawah’s death wish with the animation clay-mation stop rats with Ali Dawah’s voice in one of the rats & of the rats eating the Qur’an. no longer there. Interesting.
Yes, the doctrine of the Trinity is the backbone of Christianity – Protestants, Roman Catholics, Eastern Orthodoxy, Coptic Church and other Miaphysites, and Assyrian Church of the East all agree on the Trinity.
They all agree on the Nicene Creed and the Nicene-Constantinoplitan Creed (the 2 councils of 325 AD and 381 AD.
Protestants believe the doctrine comes from the Bible as the root and source and infallible, and the doctrine is confirmed by these councils.
Matthew 28:19
2 Cor. 13:14
John 1:1-5; 14-18
John 20:28
John 17:5
Hebrews chapter 1
Philippians 2:5-8
etc.
You get the picture! That is one reason why I went from being Roman Catholic to Islam! And I suppose that is why you are you! I rest on the credentials of all the prophets sent by their LORD. From THEIR MOUTHS and not from my own personal interpretation! There is NO compulsion in relgion. If the LIGHT is there and comes into the heart then that is fine. I don’t have any control over that. If it doesn’t then that is fine also because that was decided by the ONE WHO KNOWS.
Feel free to follow your GOD or gods or whatever the case may be. But I rejoice in the Incarnate Word or should I say reincarnated Word who came often to mankind for their benefit especially the Children of Israel and thus as he said ‘how often he would have been like a mother hen with her chicks but ye would not. And GOD is no fool to be manipulated like an ordinary piece from a game of checkers.
We have that knowledge in the Quran and Old and New Testaments but like in all things, one cannot read but only what one’s heart can see.
“But I rejoice in the Incarnate Word or should I say reincarnated Word . . . ”
This contradicts Islam. What are you saying?
were you born Roman Catholic ?
I say it all on my website islamtheway.org. Is not Jesus (pbh) the vine and THE GOD the VINEDRESSER? And what properties in him that were not good was pruned out of him but what properties GOD liked were multiplied in him according to the Gospel of John!
How can something be weaned out from someone who is born perfect? NO! He must come and learn like any man and be ‘straightened’ along the way! Although I don’t claim him to be ADAM, I just claim him to be our adam born to the flesh some 50,000 years ago or in that range as ALLAH WILLS. That knowledge would have to be understood from Ibn ‘Abbas and his comment on one of the verses in the Quran about the 7 Heavens and 7 Earths found in the Tafsir of Suyuti. And of course a lot more than this especially in the Quranic verse of announcing the simlitude of Jesus before ALLAH is like that of Adam. – LINE UPON LINE, STEP BY STEP, HERE A LITTLE, THERE A LITTLE or if you prefer saying it another way, then you will surely travel stage by stage (Quran). YOU SHOULD KNOW THAT A ROSE BY ANY OTHER NAME SMELLS JUST AS SWEET!
Did not father Abraham (pbh) rejoice to see his day and SAW IT! That day that his varied trials were not in vain and that he became that ‘chosen one’ to be what we call our Messiah! Praise be to ALLAH WHOSE PLAN IS PERFECT!!!
Jesus is the vine and the Father is the vinedresser – John 15:1
This shows that Modalism is wrong. (that the Father became Jesus for a time and then the Father became the Spirit) John 15:1 shows 2 of the persons of the Tri-personal Trinity.
It’s like being on a Ferris Wheel as the arguement keeps going round and round. You stated what I said was against Islam. How very interesting that you hold court on me with your knowledge, scanty as it may be, about Islam. But what do I see from your writing but a shout out to councils and someone hard pressed to talk about the words used by Jesus (pbh). I am affraid there is no cure for cognitive dissonance that I can offer. So, go in peace and keep pressing to find the Universal GOD.
Interesting that Paul Williams got rid of his post about Ali Dawahās death wish (on apostates and agreement with Sharia law that apostates should be killed in Islamic lands) with the animation clay-mation stop rats with Ali Dawahās voice in one of the rats & of the rats eating the Qurāan. no longer there. Interesting.
This the ultimate reality of Islam when it conquers areas and gets total political and military power.
Jordan Peterson (the famous Canadian psychologist) asked Muhammad Hijab, after M. Hijab chanted some of the Qur’an to him:
“What good does that do for someone like me?” ( who does not understand it?”)
Peterson also very clearly called Muhammad the prophet of Islam a “war-lord” who inspired the early Caliphs to conquer and subjugate by aggressive expansionist war.
The part that Hijab chanted was Surah 59:22-23
Two of the Arabic terms for Allah are:
Al Jabbar – the one who forces, compels – used of human tyrants – they called Saddam Hussein, Moamar Qaddafi, Hafez Al Assad – Jabbar – tyrants, dictators
and
Al Motakabir – the arrogant one; proud one.
J. Peterson pointed out that the Christian tradition has “turn the other cheek” and “don’t take vengeance and revenge”
A very enlightening discussion.
When the well is poisoned, the water will kill! In short dear Ken or Kennith, I’m a Muslim not because I wanted to be haughty or arrogant but because I wanted to get out from under that stuff! And besides, with a map refferencing the area called Kush or Cush of 650 BC or there abouts and knowing something about Islam, I put the the book of Zephania to the test (Chapter 3 verses 9 and 10). Here is what I found out:
Zephaniah Chapter 3 verses 9-10
The use of the symbols { } is for clarification purposes only.
Without a doubt it {The Quran} is (announced) in the {previous} revealed Books of {the} former peoples. Q (26: 196)
Zephaniah 3: 9-10 (New International Version)
Then I will purify the lips of the peoples, that all of them may call on the name of the LORD and serve him shoulder to shoulder.
From beyond the rivers of Cush my worshipers, my scattered people {Gentiles}, will bring ME offerings.
Zephaniah 3: 9-10 (21st Century King James Version)
For then will I return to the people a pure language that they may all call upon the name of the LORD, to serve HIM with one accord.
From beyond the rivers of Ethiopia MY suppliants–even the daughter of MY dispersed–shall bring MINE offering.
The Book of Zephaniah, which is a prophetical book discussing somewhat the approach of the ‘Judgment’, was originally written sometime in the 6th century BC although some scholars prefer a second century BC offering possibly borrowing on the originality of a manuscript from the 6th century BC. Whatever the truth of this matter, practically that amounts to about the same thing if the texts were followed in earnest.
It is clear and unambiguous that The GIVER of the āgiftā being spoken about comes directly from THE ONE LORD (GOD) and not something that drops into a manās head by his own doing. In other words, the gift that will be given is from GOD and directly from HIM and no other. This GIFT is mentioned as purified lips or a pure language and for a very good reason.
Verse number 9 talks of purified lips of the peoples or a pure language. When a person talks about using the lips of peoples, one is talking about a manner of speech and when one talks about a manner of speech; one is talking about a certain language that will be used.
Among humanity there is NO KNOWN pure language that has ever been invented by the hands of man. There has NEVER been a common language that has ever remained pure because like man, language that is developed from a creature (man) is like that creature ā changing.
The Eskimo living in his environment has perhaps over a hundred words for snow but people living in the desert may only have one or two words for this phenomenon.
So language reflects the utility of manās āchanging worldā and hence the language changes ā meaning that it does not remain pure but becomes adulterated according to need. Hence, the expression āI am badā can actually mean that I am good in the same language.
So at least we know that there will be a language involved instead of tap dancing. This language has to be a SPECIAL LANGUAGE and not anything that man could think of because it will have the property of being PURE and REMAINING PURE and that will be quite a feat due to manās proclivity in messing things up!
Moreover, we cannot forget that this language will be DIRECTLY from the ONE GOD and who would ever attribute to HIM imperfection but one who is deformed in the soul.
Also, the language cannot be common everyday speech because that would also get messed up by being morphed into many dialects. Rather the language must be very special AND EVEN CEREMONIAL for it to be ālocked upā and kept pure and unsullied by the hands of men.
The type of ceremonial expressions used must not be looked upon as a run of the mill experience like joining a club but rather put into an EXALTED POSITION to merit such a stance as being pure and kept pure.
There is only one logical form of highest thought taken by most men from the past to the present and that is the form of RELIGION AND RELIGIOUS EXPRESION. Hence, this protected language which is PURE and going to remain PURE is a Religious Language.
From so-called shamans to tribal chiefs or witch doctors, there is shown a way of ātalkingā to the āhigher powersā in that particular culture. The highest known symbolic discourse between man and the POWER WHO created him comes from religion and not astronomy or a study in arts and crafts.
Being a Religious Language that remains PURE cannot be for one person or for one country and as the verses claim, which is fairly easy to figure out, this language will be for various peoples WHO PRACTICE this form of worship or belief system.
A pure language like rituals will change over a period of time UNLESS of course it is in a form that a person can say and remember that it becomes the proverbial āwritten in stoneā language or a language unaltered through time.
Jesus (pbh), for example, spoke a form of Aramaic called Syriac but we do not connect with the knowledge of what he declared in that language. Basically, his language has gone through the ātreadmillā of Greek, Latin, English and whatever other language which would alter the meanings even very minutely but still they would be altered.
In other words, this PURE LANGUAGE may be spoken but it has to be PRESERVED AND REVERED such that it is in a written form that can be used as a STANDARD for checking the veracity of the spoken form or written forms coming from it and so highly thought of that any attempt to fool around with it will bring ādire consequencesā.
Hence, this written form must be duplicated in great quantities for the peoples and thusly can be easily checked out as to its maintaining its āperfectionā.
So a RECORD of the formation, development, delivery of this language has to be kept as from the beginning of its origins so as to be able to show that it has a track record of purity and not just some kind of fairytale story as an invisible book kept by and controlled by high priests.
Therefore, the best form of preservation is an actual book by which a standard can be formed to test any copies that would be made of this book or recitations given from this book.
Because we are looking at a āBookā or widespread record of some kind, the matter becomes simple. Thinking that only one book spread around many countries will fit the bill is ludicrous. Therefore, each territory or, in this case, each place of CEREMONIAL WORSHIP must have an exact duplicate of the original.
And if that ārecordā or book was to be used in individual houses, which the Quran is, it would have to remain pure and not have any alteration done on it and go undetected when challenged and still be classified as being pure.
Of course any person can alter the Quran personally but it would NOT BE ACCEPTED across communities when āput under the microscopeā and tested.
The conclusion is simple. A BOOK must exist that is GOD GIVEN and it is and fully REMAINS AVAILABLE in its ORIGINAL LANGUAGE (not just a translated form as the verses from the two of the above Old Testament translated sources are)!
Well if it is a GOD GIVEN BOOK it will be about the guidance given to man rather than instructions on how to perform tap dancing and this makes it a religious book which in turn makes it a TESTAMENT and that, in turn, makes it A SEPERATE PHASE OR FORM OF RELIGION as shown in the following verse from the New Testament.
Where there is a NEW TESTAMENT GIVEN there is a paradigm change. This means that in the common language of man there will come a NEW RELIGION. This does not mean that the religion is brand spanking new but it is NOT going to be just a carbon copy of the preceding religion even though it may harmonize with the older testament for truths shall be revealed and lies will be uncovered!
{For where a testament is {paradigm change}, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator Heb. (9: 16).}
Jesus (pbh) didnāt ādieā a physical, total journey ending in death and bodily decay as āTHE DEATHā or the completion of his sojourn but, according to Islam, he WILL RETURN to lead the Islamic kingdom on Earth and after marriage and several decades will die and be buried (with the rich ā Isaiah Chapter 53) with Prophet Muhammad (pbh) ā and they will raise up together.
Prophet Muhammad (pbh) DID DIE, however, and according to the New Testament, the PHYSICAL, COMPLETE DEATH is part of the proof of formation of an actual Religious Testament. Hence, the REALITY OF ISLAM according to this verse in the New Testament!
Worshiping with āone accordā can have many different meanings.
When one comes across a puzzler like this, one has to fit something in that will be in agreement with those two verses thus making the whole of the verses to harmonize without any contradiction. In other words, one takes that meaning that will not throw off the other meanings given in those two verses.
One can worship with one accord even though we are different as a people if that religion has a basis for belief (a basic, UNIFYING DOCTRINE) that ALL MEMBERS harmoniously believe in.
In other words, the basis of belief must be such that the upholders of that belief system understand that system no matter to what various cultures they are found in. That would be the FIVE PILLARS OF ISLAM forming the basis of that belief system or the bedrock as its foundation amongst those who believe.
āBy all of its worshipersā would mean from pole to pole and ocean to ocean such that THIS RELIGION would be a āWORLDWIDE RELIGION’ and NOT just for one city or country and that the true followers of that ONE RELIGION would follow the SAME HOLY BOOK without additional words or chapters thrown in or taken out ā unlike the Catholic Bible versus the Protestant Bible which has a different number of books in its canon ā and practice the same FIVE PILLARS.
The part about standing āshoulder to shoulderā can mean many things but it is the practice of Muslims to stand harmoniously and willingly in one accord during one of the essential pillars of faith and that is prayer ā for the prayer to be accepted ā men with men and women with women standing in straight line necessitating that they line up ‘shoulder to shoulder’!
Besides the above explanation, how can we know that Islam is being discussed in these two verses from Zephaniah? That is easy for we have the geographical location given. A religion starts descending from āaboveā through inspiration to those below. In other words, it has to have a physical presence and start from some place upon someone.
So, in this case we need to have a geographical area to deal with at the very start of this revelation. So it is easy to see that a prophet will be involved and he will be speaking to some people in the beginning and these people will have a home base or be domiciled in some geographical area.
The geographical area will be defined according to these verses based on the nature of the rivers found in the country mentioned. The country mentioned is that area of Cush or what is now known as Ethiopia.
The rivers in Ethiopia may run in a north-south or south-north direction. Therefore, one must go ACROSS from these rivers in an east-west direction to find the location of any religion that emerged from the time of the writing of this book called Zephaniah.
If one was to use willy-nilly logic and jump up or down going in a north or south direction in a random way by leapfrogging so many countries, then one could look for a religious movement with a preserved HOLY LANGUAGE coming from the north or south poles. However, when one restricts the search for this religion by going directly east or west from āacross the rivers of Ethiopiaā then one must look for that religion in those areas.
By going west from the rivers of Ethiopia one can keep going through the continent of Africa until one hits the Atlantic Ocean and NOT find any world-wide religion that can lay a claim for the fulfillment of the prophecy found in Zephaniah.
However, when one goes to the east from the rivers of Ethiopia, one does find an ESTABLISHED WORLD RELIGION WITH NEARLY A BILLION AND A HALF PEOPLE THAT FULLFILLS ALL OF THAT PROPHECY FOUND IN THE BOOK OF ZEPHANIAH and this country turns out to be Arabia specifically starting in the area called Makkah.
What about the ādispersed or scattered peopleā?
The original Children of Israel tended to be tribal and not such a propagating religious movement. Their original language varies with the times and their original records are somewhat suspect due to the various inabilities to keep alive their documents throughout history ā varied translations, yes but originals, NO!
The other branch of this ātribe,ā commonly called Christians today, do tend to be propagating as to their faith BUT DO NOT PRESENT EITHER A PURE LANGUAGE KEPT IN BOOK FORM OR A UNIFORM WAY OF WORSHIP!
That is, SOME Testament is used in a foreign-based language (Greek) or many kinds of translations making it easier for people to read and some form of creed is generally believed in but variations as to prayer, times of prayer, rituals and doctrine are quite varied and that is extremely important.
These thoughts may be taken as a form of nitpicking but what does the word āPUREā mean? Does it mean almost pure or does it imply 100% retrievable and provable pure? The verses in Zephaniah refer to the 100% form of purity not in custom but in the Language Guaranteed and Protected by the CREATOR LORD HIMSELF!
So the dispersed and scattered people would be people covering A WIDE AREA that would have been left out of the equation for salvation or those reduced to following some form of tribal paganism or even a strange philosophy (man as a GOD) as many of the Christians declare. There is another thought to this, however.
Considering the New Testament and its warnings of the ādeterioration of the truthā brought by Jesus (pbh) {refer to the scriptural sayings concerning the Spirit of truth found in the Dead Sea Scrolls and the Gospel of John) and what also is found in the Quran (Q 5: 14)}, one can gather that the floundering ship of truth must be resurrected with a PURE form of truth.
Otherwise, bringing oneās corrupted āofferingsā needs no PURE LANGUAGE or TRUTH to be sent down from the heavens when corruption will suffice or trump REALITY and that the ONE GOD will accept any old trash or falsehoods created by man to be thrown up to honor HIM!
It must be admitted that even a slow minded worshiper of any religion would be completely foolish as to confront the ONE GOD by proclaiming that HIS GIFT of a PURE LANGUAGE is foolish, misplaced or erroneous IF THAT PERSON HAS ANY HOPE OF A SUCCESSFUL FUTURE AFTERLIFE.
Without a doubt it {The Quran} is (announced) in the {previous} revealed Books of {the} former peoples {Jews/Christians}. Q (26: 196)
Praise be to ALLAH, WHO has sent to HIS Servant The BOOK {The Quran} and has allowed THEREIN NO CROOKEDNESS. Q (18: 1)
And remember ALLAH took a Covenant from the People of the Book {JEWS AND CHRISTIANS} to make it KNOWN and CLEAR to mankind and NOT to hide it {WHAT IT CONTAINED ABOUT THE COMING OF THE PROPHET OF TRUTH}; but they threw it away behind their backs and purchased with it some miserable gain! And vile was the bargain they made! Q (3: 187)
ALSO:
For those, too, who call themselves Christians, WE did take a Covenant, but they forgot a good part of the Message that was sent to them: So WE stirred up enmity and hatred between one and the other {to fight and squabble amongst themselves}, to the Day of Judgment. And soon will ALLAH show them what it is they have done. Q (5: 14)
Those who reject ALLAH {THE ONE AND ETERNAL GOD} and hinder (men) from the PATH of ALLAH, their deeds will ALLAH bring to naught {NOT ACCEPT THEIR DEEDS}. Q (47: 1)
HOWEVER:
WHOEVER {amongst the various religious peoples} goes right, then he goes right only for the benefit of his OWN SELF. And whoever goes astray, then he goes astray to his OWN LOSS. No one laden with burdens can bear another’s burden. And WE never punish until WE have sent a Messenger (to give warning). Quran 17:15