My Evangelical Christian friend (and BT contributor) Richard suggested we debate the (alleged) Old Testament prophecies of Jesus. Richard’s erudite work can be found at Steelman Apologetics, “A Christian’s respectful response to Islam”: https://steelmanapologetics.com/
Categories: Bible, Blogging Theology Youtube, Debates, Islam, Jesus, Speakers' Corner
I’m a decent way though this- it’s a shame that the begining didn’t establish what prophesies Paul thought were true. That would have made the later discussion far more useful.
unless I totally missed it
None of the passages listed by Richard were prophecies of Jesus, in my view.
what passages do you think are prophecies of Jesus? That’s the key to understanding
Paul what would you say are messianic prophesies fufiled by Jesus?
that wasn’t the subject of the discussion. Maybe i will address that one day.
It is relevant though. Knowing your methodology I’d suspect there aren’t many/any which could be applied to the ‘historical’ Jesus. I suspect that’s why you won’t just answer a simple question
you suspect too much.
Well done Paul!
good job Richard defending Daniel 9:24-27
Tovia Singer mentions the book of Daniel and defends it as written by Daniel around 530 BC. (see video below)
Those that deny it are atheists and anti-supernaturalist scholars. Singer says that they are “garbage”, along with JEPD theory, etc.
Singer also admitted that Daniel 9:26-27 uses “destroy” twice about Jerusalem and the temple and that this is about 70 AD by the Romans – wow – what a massive confession.
This shows the one who is “cut off” is the Messiah Jesus, who makes atonement for sin, etc. (verse 24)
Another Hebrew concept for “cut off from the land of the living” (died) is used in Isaiah 53:8
Shows Isaiah 53 is also about the Messiah Jesus of Nazareth
Thanks for mentioning me, Paul!
I am a fundamentalist believer – holds to the faith – the fundamental / basic doctrines of the Christian faith.
Thank you!
“Christopher Hitchens Gets it !”
Atheist Christopher Hitchens has a grasp of the central truth of Christianity. Unfortunately, the same can’t be said for some who claim the name Christian. From a recent discussion in Portland, OR, with a Unitarian minister:
Maryiln Sewell: The religion you cite in your book is generally the fundamentalist faith of various kinds. I’m a liberal Christian, and I don’t take the stories from the scripture literally. I don’t believe in the doctrine of atonement (that Jesus died for our sins, for example). Do you make and [sic] distinction between fundamentalist faith and liberal religion?
Christopher Hitchens: I would say that if you don’t believe that Jesus of Nazareth was the Christ and Messiah, and that he rose again from the dead and by his sacrifice our sins are forgiven, you’re really not in any meaningful sense a Christian.
Apparently the answer is, yes, he does make a distinction between fundamentalist faith and liberal religion. Amen.
https://str.typepad.com/weblog/2010/01/at-least-hitchens-gets-it.html
CONCLUSION (of a scholarly paper defending early date of Daniel by the prophet Daniel around 530 BC.)
It is clear that liberal scholars are ignorant of the flood of archaeological and textual materials supporting the authenticity of Daniel. Porphyry s thesis, which serves as the foundation of any modern argument for a late date, collapses under the fact that Daniel 11:40-45 refers to the future reign and destruction of a figure during the world s end times instead of the military defeat and death of Antiochus IV Epiphanes. The Nabonidus Chronicle and the Gezer Calendar demonstrate that no contradiction exists between the chronologies of Daniel 1 and 2, and the Nabonidus Chronicle verifies that Nebuchadnezzar conquered Palestine in 605 BC. Akkadian analogies authenticate the Babylonian names given to Daniel and his friends, and the Greek text of Berossus shows that Chaldeans were professional astrologers long before the sixth century BC. A careful comparison of the Qumran Prayer of Nabonidus with the portrait of Nebuchadnezzar in Daniel 4 establishes the literary independence of these texts. Recent analysis of Xenophon s Cyropaedia indicates that Darius the Mede was the throne name of the sixth-century BC Median king Cyaxares II, who headed the Medo-Persian Empire at Babylon s fall in 539 BC. Inscriptions from Haran demonstrate the existence and kingship of Belshazzar. Further, the Black Obelisk of Shalmaneser III and the Moabite Stone of Mesha endorse Daniel s loose description of Belshazzar as the
son of Nebuchadnezzar. The Hebrew-Aramaic-Hebrew structure of Daniel reflects the ABA chiastic pattern of Near Eastern composition, and the Hermopolis and Elephantine papyri along with the Dead Sea Scrolls exhibit that Daniel s Hebrew and Aramaic parallel fifth-century BC linguistics rather than second-century BC writings. Excavations at Carchemish, Mesad Hashavyahu, Arad, Babylon, and Pasargadai reveal ample contacts between the Aegean and Near East before Alexander the Great, and the Greek words for musical instruments in the Aramaic are therefore no obstacle for an early date of Daniel. Since the Ugaritic Dn il from the Ras Shamra texts was a Baal-worshiper, the Daniel mentioned in Ezekiel 14:14, 20, and 28:3 must correspond to the namesake of the book of Daniel. The Akkadian Prophecies and the story of Ahiqar demonstrate that late apocalyptic writings were modeled after Daniel and not vice versa, and Daniel s precise reference to the city of Shushan in the province of Elan displays his sixth-century BC knowledge. The E-NUN-MAH sanctuary discovered in the Neo-Babylonian stratum at Ur portrays the mode of worship described in Daniel 3. In sum, the plethora of archaeological and textual evidence surrounding the book of Daniel constitutes a powerful cumulative case that cries out for authorship by the historical prophet Daniel c. 530 BC.
Kirk McGregory, McPherson College
April, 2016
International Journal of Christian Apologetics
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/318725539_A_Contemporary_Defense_of_the_Authenticity_of_Daniel
Yes, the apostle Matthew tells us that Isaiah 7:14 is about Jesus of Nazareth and His virgin birth.
Matthew 1:21-23
The same context of Isaiah 7 extends to Isaiah 9:1-2 and 9:6