Generally, folk would say that: Democracy, secularism, tolerance, and freedom are the fundamental values (at least those are the ones promoted)
However, Paul is right to say that they have not always been the case whereas in the past it would have been: Religion, tradition, and community.
Islam possesses all of these same values as does traditional Christianity (Orthodox, Catholicism, conservative Protestants, etc…)
Probably the reason folks fail to recognize that is due to its expression (culture and dress) as well as the consistent narrative-driven in the media about Islamic terrorism/extremism being the cause of such conservatism. Another reason could be that our attitude as a society toward religion has become more dismissive as secularism has gained greater ground over the traditional role of the church in political matters.
As I’ve pointed out elsewhere; the rise in atheism in the UK is largely hereditary and as each generation comes around, the knowledge of the past has become strained, to say the least. So its little wonder that people who present themselves as ‘patriots’ would be ignorant of this.
I think we can call all of those things are similar to western values. If they consistent, those values also incompatible with Bible. Those values only compatible for people who don’t have religion.
I suppose it depends on what you mean by freedom. If you mean an absence of restrictions (do whatever you want) then, of course, the Bible doesn’t agree as there are whole sections of the Old and New testaments which dictate various ‘do’s and don’ts’ concerning both public and private matters. Just like in Islam with respect to the Sharia.
Also, it depends on which sect of Christianity you are talking about (and which period in its history). Martin Luther and John Calvin wouldn’t have been big fans of secularism or tolerance but later figures such as John Wesley and the Puritans certainly would have since it was the established Church that they were being opposed by.
Orthodoxy, by contrast, is still very much involved in the consciences of the political establishments in their respective countries, Russia for example, whereas Catholicism is very significant socially in Eastern Europe such as in Poland, Hungary, and Balkans.
But yes things have certainly changed not just in society at large but also within the Churches (for better and worse) since this has given folks the opportunity to live and practice their faith freely. I imagine that many Jewish people are happy with the diminished authority of the Church as well as Muslims who have been historically vilified as the principal enemies of Christendom.
Well, Christendom no longer exists so maybe its not something so simply dismissed as a negative that it has gone away?
I’m not a British, could you explain what are the British values?
Generally, folk would say that: Democracy, secularism, tolerance, and freedom are the fundamental values (at least those are the ones promoted)
However, Paul is right to say that they have not always been the case whereas in the past it would have been: Religion, tradition, and community.
Islam possesses all of these same values as does traditional Christianity (Orthodox, Catholicism, conservative Protestants, etc…)
Probably the reason folks fail to recognize that is due to its expression (culture and dress) as well as the consistent narrative-driven in the media about Islamic terrorism/extremism being the cause of such conservatism. Another reason could be that our attitude as a society toward religion has become more dismissive as secularism has gained greater ground over the traditional role of the church in political matters.
As I’ve pointed out elsewhere; the rise in atheism in the UK is largely hereditary and as each generation comes around, the knowledge of the past has become strained, to say the least. So its little wonder that people who present themselves as ‘patriots’ would be ignorant of this.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/jul/11/uk-secularism-on-rise-as-more-than-half-say-they-have-no-religion
I think we can call all of those things are similar to western values. If they consistent, those values also incompatible with Bible. Those values only compatible for people who don’t have religion.
Precisely
I suppose it depends on what you mean by freedom. If you mean an absence of restrictions (do whatever you want) then, of course, the Bible doesn’t agree as there are whole sections of the Old and New testaments which dictate various ‘do’s and don’ts’ concerning both public and private matters. Just like in Islam with respect to the Sharia.
Also, it depends on which sect of Christianity you are talking about (and which period in its history). Martin Luther and John Calvin wouldn’t have been big fans of secularism or tolerance but later figures such as John Wesley and the Puritans certainly would have since it was the established Church that they were being opposed by.
Orthodoxy, by contrast, is still very much involved in the consciences of the political establishments in their respective countries, Russia for example, whereas Catholicism is very significant socially in Eastern Europe such as in Poland, Hungary, and Balkans.
But yes things have certainly changed not just in society at large but also within the Churches (for better and worse) since this has given folks the opportunity to live and practice their faith freely. I imagine that many Jewish people are happy with the diminished authority of the Church as well as Muslims who have been historically vilified as the principal enemies of Christendom.
Well, Christendom no longer exists so maybe its not something so simply dismissed as a negative that it has gone away?