“By the One in Whose hand is the soul of Muhammad, there is no one among this nation, Jew or Christian, who hears of me and dies without believing in that with which I have been sent, but he will be one of the people of the Fire.”
~ Prophet Muhammad upon whom be peace.
Categories: Christianity, Hadith, Hell, Islam, Judaism, Salvation
He seems to be confused. Telling the Jews to believe what they already believe in.
Since you like the ahadith so much… The following all come from Sahih al-Bukhari. Enjoy!
Muhammad had some very unusual views about Satan. For instance, he thought that Satan urinated in people’s ears:
“Narrated Abdullah: A person was mentioned before the prophet and he was told that he had kept on sleeping till morning and has not gotten up for the (fajr – early morning) prayer. The prophet said, ‘Satan urinated in his ears.’” Vol. 2, Bk. 21, No. 245
He believed that yawning comes from Satan:
“Narrated Abu Huraira: The prophet said, ‘Yawning is from Satan and if anyone of you yawns, he should check his yawning as much as possible, for if anyone of you (during the act of yawning) should say: ‘Ha’, Satan will laugh at him.’” Vol. 4, Bk. 54, No. 509 – see also Vol. 8, Bk. 73, No. 242
Muhammad even claimed that Satan actually lodges in the upper part of a person’s nose during the night and therefore needed to be flushed out every morning by snorting water in and out of one’s nose!
“Narrated Abu Huraira: The prophet said, ‘if anyone of you rouses from sleep and performs the ablution, he should wash his nose by putting water in it and then blowing it out thrice, because Satan has stayed in the upper part of his nose all the night.’” Vol. 4, Bk. 54, No. 516
The footnote to this particular hadith states:
“We should believe that Satan actually stays in the upper part of one’s nose, though we cannot perceive how, for this is related to the unseen world of which we know nothing except what Allah tells us through his messenger.”
Desperate attempts have been made to make sense of this tradition. One explanation given is that “Satan” refers to harmful things within the nose that need to be flushed out. If this were the case, then something harmful enters one’s nose during the day as well as the night; yet this Hadith emphasizes night, implying that Satan literally enters one’s nose at nighttime, or so Muhammad believed.
To make matters worse, Muhammad actually thought that Satan could fart or pass wind!
“Narrated Abu Huraira: Allah’s apostle said, ‘When the Adhan is pronounced Satan takes to his heels and passes wind with noise during his flight in order not to hear the Adhan. When the Adhan is completed he comes back and again takes to his heels when the Iqama is pronounced and after its completion he returns again till he whispers into the heart of the person (to divert his attention from his prayer) and makes him remember things which he does not recall to his mind before the prayer and that causes him to forget how much he has prayed.’” Volume 1, Book 11, Number 582
Finally, Muhammad thought that a bad dream is from Satan and one “should spit on his side thrice and seek refuge with Allah from its evil; then it will not harm him.” (Sahih Muslim, Bk. 29, Number 5613). One is left wondering how does spitting three times to the side affect Satan?
Is this the actual answering-islam?
@ Weihan
Yes
Muhammad believed that angels do not enter a house that has a dog:
“Narrated Abu Talha: The prophet said, ‘Angels do not enter a house witch has either a dog or a picture in it.’” Vol. 4, Bk. 54, No. 539 – see also Vol. 5, Bk. 59, No. 338
And:
Chapter 19: ANGELS DO NOT ENTER A HOUSE IN WHICH THERE IS A DOG OR A PICTURE
A’isha reported that Gabriel made a promise with Allah’s Messenger to come at a definite hour; that hour came but he did not visit him. And there was in his hand (in the hand of Allah’s Apostle) a staff. He threw it from his hand and said: Never has Allah or His messengers (angels) ever broken their promise. Then he cast a glance (and by chance) found a puppy under his cot and said: ‘A’isha, when did this dog enter here? She said: By Allah, I don’t know. He then commanded and it was turned out. Then Gabriel came and Allah’s Messenger said to him: You promised me and I waited for you, but you did not come, whereupon he said: It was the dog in your house which prevented me (to come), for we (angels) do not enter a house in which there is a dog or a picture. (Sahih Muslim, Book 024, Number 5246)
And because of this, “Allah’s Apostle ordered that the dogs should be killed” (Vol. 4, No. 540).
Later, after realizing that dogs were a necessity for hunting and guarding sheep, Muhammad changed his mind:
Maimuna reported that one morning Allah’s Messenger was silent with grief. Maimuna said: Allah’s Messenger, I find a change in your mood today. Allah’s Messenger said: Gabriel had promised me that he would meet me tonight, but he did not meet me. By Allah, he never broke his promises, and Allah’s Messenger spent the day in this sad (mood). Then it occurred to him that there had been a puppy under their cot. He commanded and it was turned out. He then took some water in his hand and sprinkled it at that place. When it was evening Gabriel met him and he said to him: you promised me that you would meet me the previous night. He said: Yes, but we do not enter a house in which there is a dog or a picture. Then on that very morning he commanded the killing of the dogs until he announced that the dog kept for the orchards should also be killed, but he spared the dog meant for the protection of extensive fields (or big gardens). (Sahih Muslim, Book 024, Number 5248)
Chapter 31: COMMAND OF KILLING DOGS AND THEN ITS ABROGATION, AND PROHIBITION OF KEEPING THEM BUT FOR HUNTING AND PROTECTION OF LANDS OR CATTLE OR LIKE THAT…
Ibn Umar reported that Allah’s messenger ordered the killings of dogs except the dog tamed for hunting, or watching of the herd of sheep or other domestic animals…” (Sahih Muslim, Book 010, Number 3812)
Abu Zubair heard Jabir b. Abdullah saying: Allah’s messenger ordered us to kill dogs, and we carried out this order so much that we also killed the dog coming with a woman from the desert. Then Allah’s Apostle forbade their killing. He (the Holy Prophet) further said: It is your duty to kill the jet black (dog) having two spots (on the eyes), for it is a devil. (Sahih Muslim, Book 010, Number 3813)
These narrations raise a few questions. First, if Allah’s angels are capable of withstanding Satan himself, how can dogs or pictures stop them from accomplishing their tasks? Second, couldn’t “Gabriel” have waited for Muhammad to come outside of his house in order to speak with him? Or couldn’t he have met Muhammad in his mosque? Why did this “Gabriel” have to speak to Muhammad in his house where the dead dog was? Third, if dogs are really devils then why does the Quran say that Allah protected a dog along with the Companions of the Cave (Q. 18:18 and 18:20)? Is Allah in the business of preserving evil animals as they lay asleep for centuries only to awaken them again? More importantly, what were these righteous servants doing with a dog in the first place? Fourth, didn’t Allah give Solomon power over the Jinn to build statues or images (Q. 34:13)? And didn’t the temple which Solomon built for the worship of God contain images (1 Kings 6:23-35; 7:27-37; 2 Chronicles 3:10-14)? Does this therefore mean that the angels never entered Solomon’s palace or temple?
The translator of Sahih Muslim, Abdul Hamid Siddiqui, tries to desperately explain away the obvious problems with Muhammad’s stance on dogs,
“The Hadith gives us an idea why the Holy Prophet commanded to kill dogs. There must have been an excess of stray dogs and thus the danger of rabies in the city of Medina and its suburbs. The Holy Prophet, therefore, ordered to kill them. Later on when it was found that his companions were killing them indiscriminately, he forbade them to do so and told them that only ferocious beasts which were a source of danger to life should be killed. The word ‘devil’ clarifies this point. Here devil stands for ferocious…” (Sahih Muslim by Imam Muslim, rendered into English by Abdul Hamid Siddiqui [Kitab Bhavan, New Delhi, India, 11th Reprint 1995], Volume III & IV, Book X. Kitab Al-Buyu’ (Pertaining To Business Transactions), p. 825, fn. 2012; italic emphasis ours)
One senses Siddiqui’s desperation to defend the killing of dogs. He tries to justify this by assuming that there was an excess of stray and rabid dogs in Medina, yet provides no proof for such a claim. Secondly, even if his assumption was correct, why did Muhammad allow both hunting and sheep dogs to remain alive? After all, these dogs would be just as deadly since they would come in contact with ferocious disease-infested animals that could have easily transmitted these diseases to humans. Furthermore, we are still left to grapple with the problem of jet-black dogs with two spots being devils. If “devil”, as Sidiqqi states, means ferocious, then why single out these dogs as devils when there were other dogs just as, or even more, ferocious than they? It would seem that Muhammad believed that these animals were literally possessed by devils.
Finally, Muhammad declared that if any man were to keep a dog other than for hunting or guarding the herd, he “loses everyday out of his deeds equal to two qiraat” (Sahih Muslim, Book 010, Number 3815). In other words, Muslims with house-dogs would lose their eternal rewards.
Muhammad believed that people would be tormented in their graves for soiling their clothes with their urine:
“Narrated Ibn Abbas: ‘Once the prophet while passing through one of the Heytan (gardens or graveyards) of Al-Medina or Makka, heard the voices of two persons who were being tortured in their graves. The prophet said, ‘These two persons are being tortured not for a major sin (to avoid).’ He then added, ‘Yes! (There they are being tortured for a major sin). Indeed, one of them never saved himself from being soiled with his urine while the other used to go about with calumnies (to make enmity between friends).’
And how did Muhammad expect them to receive relief from their pain?
“The prophet then asked for a green branch (of a date-palm tree), broke it into two pieces and put one on each grave. On being asked why he had done so, he replied, ‘I hope that their torture might be lessened, till these get dried.’” Vol. 1, Bk. 4, No. 215
In fact, Muhammad believed that certain types of urine had a medicinal effect:
“(Narrated Abu Qilaba): Anas said, ‘some people of ‘Ukal or ‘Uraina tribe came to Al-Medina and its climate did not suit them. So the prophet ordered them to go to the herd of (milch) camels and to drink their milk and urine (as a medicine) …” Vol. 1, Bk. 4, No. 234
Another tradition says that Muhammad told them to, “drink a mixture of its (camel’s) milk and urine.” (As-Sayyid Sabiq, Fiqh us-Sunnah, Purification and Prayer, vol. 1, p. 12)
Muslim scholars have used these traditions to prove that Muhammad made animal urine permissible to drink. For instance, the compiler of the five-volume set of Fiqh us-Sunnah says that, “by analogy, other permissible animals’ urine may also be considered pure.” (Ibid.)
And according to Ibn al-Munzhir, “Those who claim that that was permissible only for those people are incorrect,” since “scholars permit, without any objection, the sale of sheep’s stools and the use of camel’s urine in their medicine, both in the past and in the present, again without any objection. This shows that they are considered pure.” (Ibid.)
Ash-Shaukani stated that, “Apparently, the urine and stools of every animal permissible to eat is pure.” (Ibid.)
To this the compiler states, “There is nothing to prove otherwise.” (Ibid.)
The following narrative shows us the type of reasoning Muhammad used to conclude that a group of Jews had been transformed into rats:
“Narrated (Abu Huraira): The prophet said, ‘a group of Israelites was lost. Nobody knows what they did. But I do not see them except that they were cursed and transformed into rats, for if you put the milk of a she-camel in front of a rat, it will not drink it, but if the milk of a sheep is put in front of it, it will drink it.’ I told this to Ka’b who asked me, ‘did you hear it from the prophet?’ “I said, ‘Yes”. Ka’b asked me the question several times; I said to Ka’b, ‘do I read the Taurat (Torah)? (i.e., I tell you this from the prophet).’” Vol. 4, Bk. 54, No. 524
What does the footnote say?
“Later on, the prophet was informed through inspiration about the fate of those Israelites: They were transformed into pigs and monkeys.”
This footnote is not alone in affirming the literal transformation of humans into animals. Several of Islam’s greatest scholars, namely, Baidawi, al-Zamakhshari, and the two Jalalans in their commentaries also believed that some of the Jews were literally transformed into animals.
Muhammad further believed that on the judgment day Allah would transform Abraham’s pagan father into a hyena and throw him in hell:
“Narrated Abu Huraira: The prophet said, ‘On the Day of Resurrection Abraham will meet his father Azar whose face will be dark and covered with dust. (The Prophet Abraham will say to him): “Didn’t I tell you not to disobey me?” His father will reply: “Today I will not disobey you.” Abraham will say: “O Lord! You promised me not to disgrace me on the Day of Resurrection; and what will be more disgraceful to me than cursing and dishonoring my father?” Then Allah will say (to him):’ “I have forbidden Paradise for the disbelievers.” Then he will be addressed, “O Abraham! Look! What is underneath your feet?” He will look and there he will see a Dhabh (an animal,) blood-stained, which will be caught by the legs and thrown in the (Hell) Fire.’” Vol. 4, Bk. 55, No. 569
In light of this, it shouldn’t surprise us that Muhammad actually thought that his god would literally change people’s faces into donkeys if they raised their heads in prayers before the imam!
“Narrated Abu Huraira: the prophet said, ‘isn’t he who raises his head before the Imam afraid that Allah may transform his head into that of a donkey or his figure (face) into that of a donkey?” Vol. 1, Bk. 11, No. 660
“Narrated An-Nu’man bin Bashar: the prophet said, ‘straighten your rows or Allah will alter your faces.’” Vol. 1, Bk. 11, No. 685
Once more, we are told by the translator that,
“This is a severe warning, that if you do not straighten your rows [in Salat (prayers)], Allah may change your faces to that of an animal, e.g. donkey, etc. Or make them like the backs of necks, etc. (see Fath Al-Bari, Vol. 2, page 349).”
SHARIAH OBSERVANT MONKEYS
One of Muhammad’s companions claimed to have witnessed and assisted a group of monkeys in stoning a she-monkey for committing adultery!
Narrated ‘Amr bin Maimun: During the pre-Islamic period of ignorance I saw a she-monkey surrounded by a number of monkeys. They were all stoning it, because it had committed illegal sexual intercourse. I too stoned it along with them. Vol. 5, Bk. 58, No. 188
Need we say more?
Ha Ha, that really is a good one! What is the source for this, is this serious “monkey” business or is it nonsense?
Sahih al-bukhari
The majority of people in hell will be women since Muhammad is reported to have warned a group of female followers that they should,
“‘Give alms, as I have seen that the majority of the dwellers of hell-fire were you (women).’ They asked, ‘Why is it so, O Allah’s messenger?’ He replied, ‘You curse frequently and are ungrateful to your husbands. I have not seen anyone more deficient in intelligence and religion than you. A cautious, sensible man could be led astray by some of you.’ The women asked, ‘O Allah’s messenger! What is deficient in our intelligence and religion?’ He said, ‘Is not the witness (evidence) of two women equal to the witness of one man?’ They replied in the affirmative. He said, ‘This is the deficiency in your intelligence. Isn’t it true that a woman can neither pray nor fast during her menses?’ The women replied in the affirmative. He said, ‘This is the deficiency in your religion.’” Vol. 1, Bk. 6, No. 301 – see also Vol. 4, Bk. 54, No. 464
Women are also an evil omen and are the most harmful thing for men:
“Narrated Abdullah bin Umar: I heard the prophet saying, ‘Evil omen is in three things: the horse, the woman, and the house.’” Vol. 4, Bk. 52, No. 110
“Narrated Usarra bin Zaid: The prophet said, ‘After me I have not left any Fitnah (trial and affliction, etc.) more harmful to men than women.’” Vol. 7, Bk. 62, No. 33
Muhammad taught that angels curse any woman who refuses to sleep with her husband:
“Narrated Abu Huraira: Allah’s messenger said, ‘If a husband calls his wife to his bed (i.e. have sexual relation) and she refuses and curses him in anger, the angels will curse her till morning.’” Vol. 4, Bk. 54, No. 460
Muhammad commanded that, if a person is away and is returning home from his journey, he must not enter until,
“the woman whose husband was absent (from the house) shaves her pubic hair and the woman with unkempt hair, combs her hair.” Vol. 7, Bk. 62, No. 173
TEMPORARY MARRIAGES
For a while, Muhammad allowed what is called Mut’a, temporary marriages for Muslims to satisfy their sexual desires.
“Narrated Abdullah: We used to participate in the holy wars carried on by the prophet and we had no women (wives) with us. So we said (to the prophet) ‘Shall we castrate ourselves?’ But the prophet forbade us to do that and thenceforth he allowed us to marry a woman (temporarily) by giving her even a garment, and then he recited: ‘O you who believe! Make not unlawful the Tayyibât (all that is good as regards foods, things, deeds, beliefs, persons, etc.) which Allah has made lawful to you.’” Vol. 6, Bk. 60, No. 139
This would be considered a form of legal prostitution, since these were not real marriages but sexual services which the Muslims paid for.
RUNNING STONES AND TALKING TREES
Muhammad erroneously believed that inanimate objects could actually speak and feel, and do other things like humans do:
“Narrated Abdullah bin Umar: Allah’s messenger said, ‘You (i.e. Muslims) will fight against the Jews till some of them will hide behind stones. The stones will (betray them) saying, ‘O Abdallah (i.e. slave of Allah)! There is a Jew hiding behind me; so kill him.’ In another quotation: ‘The hour will not come until you fight against Jews.’” Vol. 4, Bk. 52, No. 176
“Narrated Abdullah bin Masúd that he was asked, ‘As to who informed the prophet about the Jinns at night when they heard the Quran?’ He said that a tree informed the prophet about them.” Vol. 5, Bk. 58, No. 199
“Narrated Jabir bin Abdullah: The prophet used to stand by a stem of a date-palm tree (while delivering a Khutba). When the pulpit was placed for him we heard that stem crying like a pregnant she-camel till the prophet got down from the pulpit and place his hand over it.” Vol. 2, Bk. 13, No. 41
“Narrated (Abu Huraira): The prophet said, ‘The (people of) Bani Israel used to take bath naked (all together) looking at each other. Prophet Musa (Moses) used to take bath alone. They said, ‘By Allah! Nothing prevents Musa (Moses) from taking a bath with us except that he has a scrotal Hernia.’ So once Musa (Moses) went out to take a bath and put his clothes over a stone and then that stone ran away with his clothes. Musa (Moses) followed that stone saying, ‘My clothes, O stone! My clothes, O stone!’ till the people of Bani Israel saw him and said, ‘By Allah, Musa (Moses) has got no defect in his body.’ Musa (Moses) took his clothes and began to beat the stone.’ Abu Huraira added, ‘By Allah! There are still six or seven marks present on the stone from that excessive beating.’” Vol. 1, Bk. 5, No. 277
GAS AND GARLIC
Muhammad and his deity really disliked farting or passing wind:
“Narrated Abu Huraira: Allah’s messenger said, ‘The Salat (prayer) of a person who does Hadath (passes urine, stool or wind) is not accepted till he performs (repeats) the ablution.’ A person from Hadramout asked Abu Huraira, ‘What is Hadath?’ Abu Huraira replied, ‘Hadath means the passing of wind from the anus.’” Vol. 1, Bk. 4, No. 137
“Narrated Abdullah bin Yazid Al-Ansari: He asked Allah’s messenger about a person who imagined to have passed wind during the Salat (prayer). Allah’s messenger replied: ‘He should not leave his Salat (prayer) unless he hears sound or smells something.’” Vol. 1, Bk. 4, No. 139
According to Muhammad, when angels pray they say,
“O Allah! Forgive him, as long as he keeps on sitting at his praying place and does not pass wind.” Vol. 1, Bk. 8, No. 466
He also prohibited people coming to the mosque after eating garlic:
“(Narrated ‘Ata): I heard Jabir bin Abdullah saying, ‘The prophet said, ‘Whoever eats (from) this plant (he meant garlic), should keep away from our mosque.’ I said, ‘What does he mean by that?’ He replied, ‘I think he means only raw garlic.’” Vol. 1, No. 813 – see also No. 814
WHAT DO JINNS EAT?
Muhammad claimed that Jinns (spirits) eat bones and animal dung! Vol. 5, Bk. 58, No. 200
BLACKS AND SLAVES IN ISLAM
We find Muhammad making racist comments in regard to people with black skin:
“Narrated Anas bin Malik: Allah’s messenger said, ‘You should listen to and obey your Imam (Muslim ruler), even if he was an Ethiopian (black) slave whose head looks like a raisin.’” Vol. 9, Bk. 89, No. 256 and Vol. 1, Bk. 11, No. 662
Dreaming of a black woman can be a sign of disease:
“Narrated Ibn Umar: The prophet said, ‘I saw (in a dream) a black woman with unkempt hair going out of Al-Madina and settling at Mahya’a, i.e. Al-Juhfa. I interpreted that as a symbol of epidemic of Al-Madina being transferred to that place (Al-Juhfa).’” Vol. 9, No. 161
In fact, it will be a black man who will steal stones from the Ka’bah!
“Narrated Ibn Abbas: The prophet said, ‘As if I am looking at him, a black person with thin legs plucking the stones of the Ka’bah one after the other.’” Vol. 2, Bk. 26, No. 665
Muhammad also owned black slaves. For instance, Umar b. Al-Khattab came to Muhammad’s house and found that, “A black slave of Allah’s Apostle was sitting on the first step.” Vol. 6, Bk. 60, No. 435
Here is another example:
“Narrated Anas bin Malik: Allah’s apostle was on a journey and he had a black slave called Anjasha, and he was driving the camels (very fast, and there were women riding on those camels). Allah’s apostle said, ‘Waihaka (May Allah be merciful to you), O Anjasha! Drive slowly (the camels) with the glass vessels (women)!'” Vol. 8, Bk. 73, No. 182
Muhammad not only owned slaves, but also sold black slaves for profit or exchanged them for others:
Jabir reported: There came a slave and pledged allegiance to Allah’s apostle on migration; he (the prophet) did not know that he was a slave. Then there came his master and demanded him back, whereupon Allah’s Apostle said: Sell him to me. And he bought him for two black slaves, and he did not afterwards take allegiance from anyone until he had asked him whether he was a slave (or a free man). (Sahih Muslim, Book 010, Number 3901)
These next hadiths show that Muhammad was anything but a mercy to all creatures:
“Narrated Jabir bin Abdullah: A man decided that a slave of his would be manumitted after his death and later on he was in need of money, so the prophet took the slave and said, ‘Who will buy this slave from me?’ Nu’amin bin Abdullah bought him for such and such price and the prophet gave him the slave.’” Vol. 3, Bk. 34, No. 351
“Narrated ‘Urwa on the authority of ‘Aisha: On the days of Mina, (11th, 12th, and 13th of Dhul-Hijjah) Abu Bakr came to her while two young girls were beating the tambourine and the prophet was lying covered with his clothes. Abu Bakr scolded them and the prophet uncovered his face and said to Abu Bakr, ‘Leave them, for these days are the days of ‘Id and the days of Mina.’ ‘Aisha further said, ‘Once the prophet was screening me and I was watching the display of black slaves in the Mosque and (‘Umar) scolded them. The prophet said, ‘Leave them. O Bani Arfida! (carry on), you are safe (protected)’.” Vol. 2, Bk. 15, No. 103
One wonders why the selling of a slave was needed to cover his master’s debt, when the slave was to be freed following the death of his owner? Could Muhammad not have simply sold a piece of property or asked the creditor to cancel his debt for the sake of Allah? And why would he allow black slaves to be paraded around in his mosque? Was Muhammad running a slave trading business in the mosque, which is supposed to be a place where Allah, whom the Quran labels as the most merciful and most compassionate, is worshiped?
HOLY SPITTLE AND SACRED CLEANSING
That the obsession of Muhammad’s followers with their prophet bordered on the fanatical can readily be seen from the following narrations:
“By Allah, whenever Allah’s apostle spat, the spittle would fall in the hand of one of them [i.e. the prophet’s companions] who would rub it on his face and skin.” Vol. 3, Bk. 50, No. 891
“Narrated Jabir: The prophet came to (the grave of) Abdullah bin Ubai after his body was buried. The body was brought out and then the prophet put his saliva over the body and clothed it in his shirt.” Vol. 2, No. 360
“Narrated Abu Musa: Then the prophet asked for a drinking bowl containing water and washed his hands and face in it, and then took a mouthful of water and threw it therein saying (to us), ‘Drink (some of it) and pour (some) over your faces and chests and be happy at the good tidings.’” Vol. 5, Bk. 59, No. 617
“Narrated Abu Juhaifa: Allah’s messenger came to us at noon and water for ablution was brought to him. After he had performed ablution, the remaining water was taken by the people and they started smearing their bodies with it (as a blessed thing).” Vol. 1, Bk. 4, No. 187 and 188
Can anyone deny that such devotion to Muhammad is not only bizarre or outright filthy and disgusting, but also idolatrous?
ADAM THE NOT SO JOLLY GIANT
“Narrated Abu Huraira: The prophet said, ‘Allah created Adam, and his height was 60 cubits.’” Vol. 4, Bk. 55, No. 543
That makes Adam 90 feet tall! Presumably, Adam’s children would also be as tall as their father, a fact affirmed in this Hadith:
“Narrated Abu Huraira: The prophet said, ‘Allah created Adam in his image sixty cubits (about 30 meters) in height… Since then the creation of Adam’s (offspring) (i.e., stature of human beings) is being diminished continuously up to the present time.’” Vol. 8, Bk. 74, No. 246
To make matters worse, Muhammad actually believed that in paradise people would again become 90 feet tall!
“Narrated Abu Huraira: Allah’s apostle said, ‘The first group of people who will enter Paradise, will be glittering like the full moon and those who will follow them, will glitter like the most brilliant star in the sky. They will not urinate, relieve nature, spit, or have any nasal secretions. Their combs will be of gold, and their sweat will smell like musk… Their wives will be houris. All of them will look alike and will resemble their father Adam (in statute), sixty cubits tall.’” Vol. 4, Bk. 55, No. 544
There is no evidence whatsoever, either from ancient records or the fossil beds, which would indicate that human beings were as tall as 90 feet, or that mankind has been shrinking in height since Adam’s time. This is a serious scientific error.
GENETICS
Muhammad declared,
“As for the resemblance of the child to its parents; if a man has sexual intercourse with his wife and gets a discharge first, the child will resemble the father, and if the woman gets her discharge first, the child will resemble her.” Vol. 4, Bk. 55, No. 546
Scientists tell us that it is genetics, not “discharges”, that affect a child’s physical characteristics.
To avoid this obvious and gross scientific error, certain Muslims have been forced to give new meanings to the Arabic text of this Hadith, forcing it to fit in with modern scientific understanding.2
This of course is an attempt to compel the Hadith to say something which it does not say. Keep in mind that Dr. Muhammad Muhsin Khan who translated this hadith is a devout Muslim that has studied the Arabic meticulously and would therefore do his best to provide the most accurate translation possible. Moreover, Khan would have had other Muslim scholars analyze his collection before sending it to be published. In fact, here is how another Muslim scholar translates this same hadith:
3151. It is related that Anas said, “When ‘Abdullah ibn Salam heard of the arrival of the Messenger of Allah in Madina, he went to him and said, ‘I will ask you about three things which only a Prophet knows. What is the first sign of the Hour? What is the first food that the people of the Garden will eat? And for what reason does a child resemble his father and for what reason does he resemble his maternal uncles?’ The Messenger of Allah said, ‘Jibril has just informed me about them.'” He said that ‘Abdullah said, “That is the enemy of the Jews among the angels.”
The Messenger of Allah said, “The first sign of the Hour will be a fire which will gather people from the east to the west. The first food that the people of the Garden will eat will be the extra bit of the liver of the fish. As for the child’s resemblance, when the man has intercourse with the woman and his discharge is first, it will resemble him. If she has a discharge first, then it will resemble her.” He said, “I testify that you are the Messenger of Allah.” … (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 64. Book of the Prophets, II: The words of Allah Almighty, “When your Lord said to the angels: ‘I am putting a khalif on the earth.” (2:30); *; bold and italic emphasis ours)
This sounds the death knell to any Muslim attempt to translate the Hadith in any other way. That some Muslims mistranslate the Arabic in order to give new meanings to established Arabic words only reinforces the fact that both the Quran and Ahadith contain gross scientific and historical blunders.
To solidify the case that Muhammad believed that sexual climaxes influenced physical characteristics we quote this tradition:
“Narrated Zainab bint Um Salama: Um Sulaim ‘O Allah’s apostle! Verily Allah is not shy of (telling you) the truth. Is it essential for a woman to take a bath after she had a wet dream (nocturnal sexual discharges)?’ He said, ‘Yes, if she notices discharge. On that Um Salama laughed and said, ‘Does a woman get a (nocturnal sexual) discharge?’ He said, ‘How then does (here) son resemble her (his mother)?’” Vol. 8, Bk. 73, No. 113
Obviously, the thing that a woman discharges during a wet dream is not chromosomes. It clearly refers to sexual orgasm, affirming that in Muhammad’s mind a child’s looks were influenced by whomever climaxed first.
Even more fascinating is the fact that the previous Hadith, when read in context, incriminates Muhammad of plagiarizing information that was known prior to and contemporary with his times:
“Narrated Anas: When ‘Abdullah bin Salam heard of the arrival of the Prophet at Al-Madina, he came to him and said, ‘I am going to ask you about three things which nobody knows except a Prophet:
What is the first portent of the Hour?
What will be the first meal taken by the people of Paradise?
Why does a child resemble its father, and why does it resemble its maternal uncle?’
Allah’s Messenger said, ‘Jibrael (Gabriel) has just now told me of their answers…’”
After answering all three questions, Salam states, “I testify that you are the Messenger of Allah.”
Two questions arise:
1) If as Ibn Salam indicates, only a true Prophet would be capable of answering these questions, how did Ibn Salam know Muhammad had answered correctly? This would make Ibn Salam a Prophet as well.
2) That Ibn Salam knew these answers already, strongly indicates that the information pertaining to acquired physical characteristics was nothing new, since Ibn Salam had known this information beforehand. This suggests that the embryological details contained in both the Quran and Hadith, although grossly in error, were something which Muhammad had borrowed from already existing sources circulating at that time.
Hence, there is nothing miraculous about this Hadith, contrary to what Muslims would have us believe.2
2 As was noted earlier, Muslims have attempted to make this Hadith fit in with modern genetic understanding. For instance, Muslim propagandist, Dr. Jamal Badawi*, proposes the following interpretation: When the Hadith states that it is either the man’s or woman’s discharge which influences the looks of a child, discharge is actually referring to the male sperm either discharging Y chromosome, which would make the child male, or X chromosome making it female, since the woman’s ovaries are always XX. Furthermore, the term “resemble” refers to gender i.e., that the child will either resemble the sex of the father or the mother.
Although this is more of a desperate explanation than a true translation as was already noted, this particular narration duly refutes Badawi’s interpretation. This is due to the fact that the questioner asked Muhammad as to why a child resembles either its father or its “maternal uncle,” implying that the term “resemble” refers to looks and not gender, since it is impossible for the male semen containing the X (female) chromosome to influence a child acquiring his maternal uncle’s gender!
Thus, no matter from what angle one examines this Hadith the gross scientific errors remain.
THE EDIBLE MOUSE AND THE FLYING CURE
“Narrated Maimuna: Allah’s messenger was asked regarding ghee (cooking butter) in which a mouse had fallen. He said, ‘Take out the mouse and throw away the ghee around it and use the rest.’” Vol. 1, Bk. 4, No. 236
“Narrated (Abu Huraira): The prophet said, ‘If a housefly falls in the drink of anyone of you, he should dip it (in the drink), for one of its wings has a disease and the other has the cure for the disease.’” Vol. 4, Bk. 54, No. 537
If one were to do this there might be a possible outbreak of typhoid and cholera.1
1 In Dr. Khan’s footnote, he attempts to provide medical support for the fly-in-the-cup theory:
“Medically it is well-known now that a fly carries some pathogens on some parts of its body as mentioned by the Prophet (before 1400 years approx. When the humans knew very little of modern medicine.) Similarly Allah created organisms and other mechanisms which kill these pathogens e.g. Peninculan Fungus kills pathogenic organisms like Staphy Lococci and others etc. Recently experiments have been done under supervision which indicate that a fly carries the disease (pathogens) plus the antidote for those pathogenic organisms. Ordinarily when a fly touches a liquid food it infects the liquid with its pathogens, so it must be dipped in order to release also the antidote for those pathogens to act as a counter-balance to the pathogens.
“Regarding this subject I also wrote through a friend of mine Dr. Muhammad M. El-Samahy, chief of Hadith Dept. In Al-Azhar University Cairo (Egypt), who has written an article upon this Hadith and as regards medical aspects, he has mentioned that the microbiologists have proved that there are longitudinal yeast cells living as parasites inside the belly of the fly and these yeast cells in order to repeat their lifecycle protrude through respiratory tubules of the fly and if the fly is dipped in a liquid, these cells burst in the fluid and the content of those cells is an antidote for the pathogen which the fly carries.” (Pp. 656-657, ft. 3; bold emphasis ours)
Several points need to be made in light of these assertions:
1) No microbiologists’ names have been provided, nor the name of the place where the experiment occurred, which documents the results of this so-called study.
2) The compiler mentions no non-Muslims to give more credibility to his statements, citing only Muslims who naturally have an Islamic bias and would therefore want to prove that Muhammad was right.
3) Finally, the Imam admits that the disease and its cure are found in certain parts of the fly’s body, more specifically its belly, which actually proves that Muhammad was still in error. Muhammad clearly stated that the disease and the antidote are found in the wings of the fly, not it’s belly! This is a serious error for a God-inspired prophet to make since God would certainly know the exact spot on the insect’s body where the antidote can be found.
THE RISING AND SETTING OF THE SUN
“Narrated Abu Dharr: The prophet asked me at sunset, ‘Do you know where the sun goes (at the time of sunset)?’ I replied, ‘Allah and his messenger know better.’ He said, ‘It goes (i.e. travels) till it prostrates itself underneath the throne, and takes the permission to rise again, and it is permitted and then (a time will come when) it will be about to prostrate itself but its prostration will not be accepted, and it will ask permission to go on its course, but it will not be permitted, but it will be ordered to return whence it has come and so it will rise in the West. And that is the interpretation of the statement of Allah: ‘And the sun runs on its fixed course for a term (appointed). This is the decree of (Allah) the All-Mighty, the All-Knowing.’” Vol. 4, Bk. 54, No. 421
Here we have the sun traveling, bowing, speaking and rising from the West, instead of the East. Even the translator is at a loss for words in trying to reconcile these obvious scientific errors and tries to give an explanation in his footnote:
“The procedure of the sun mentioned in this Hadith and similar other things mentioned in the Quran like the prostration of the trees, herbs, and stars, etc. (v. 55:6) are beyond our limited knowledge of this universe. It is interpreted that these are mentioned so because of our limited understanding of the people at that time about the matters of the universe.” (Italic emphasis ours)
It might be argued that the rising from the West is something that takes place at the Last Day as one of God’s signs. The problem is not with the sun rising from the West but rather with it traveling in a circuit since the sun only travels in relation with the galaxy. Hence, the entire galaxy makes a circuit, not just the sun itself, as this Hadith seems to imply. Hence, Muhammad’s assertion would entail that the entire galaxy prostrates under Allah’s throne as well!
But it gets worse. Muhammad taught that the sun literally, physically sets in a spring of water!
One of the major signs of the Hour
91. Abu Dharr narrated, “Once I was with the Prophet (riding) a donkey on which there was a saddle or a (piece of) velvet. That was at sunset. He said to me, ‘O Abu Dharr, do you know where this (sun) sets?’ I said, ‘Allah and His Messenger know better.’ He said, ‘It sets in a spring of murky water, (then) it goes and prostrates before its Lord, the Exalted in Might and the Ever-Majestic, under the Throne. And when it is time to go out, Allah allows it to go out and thus it rises. But, when He wants to make it rise where it sets, He locks it up. The sun will then say, “O my Lord, I have a long distance to run.” Allah will say, “Rise where you have set.” That (will take place) when no (disbelieving) soul will get any good by believing then.’” (Ahmad) (The Translation of: The Meaning of the Fifty Hadith of Jame Al-uloom Wal-Hakim (“A Compilation of Knowledge and Wisdom”), compilation by Ibn Rajab al-Hanbali (736 H-795 H), translated and spotlights by Yaseen Ibrahim al-Sheikh (Vol. 1), A Selection of Authentic Qudsi (Sacred) Hadiths, translated by Muhammad M. ‘Abdul-Fattah, edited by Reima Youssif Shakeir (Vol. 2) [Dar Al-Manarrah for Translation, Publishing & Distribution], pp. 319-320)
And:
(3991) Abu Dharr said: I was sitting behind the apostle of Allah who was riding a donkey while the sun was setting. He asked: Do you know where this sets? I replied: Allah and his apostle know best. He said: IT SETS IN A SPRING OF WARM WATER (hamiyah).3408 (Prof. Ahmad Hasan, Sunan Abu Dawud – English Translation With Explanatory Notes [Sh. Muhammad Ashraf, Publishers, Lahore, 1984], Volume III. Chapters 1338-1890, XXV. Kitab Al-Ahruf Wa Al-Qira’at [Book of Dialects and Readings Of The Qur’an], Chapter 1498, p. 1120; bold and capital emphasis ours)
3408. Qur’an, xviii. 86. The word hami’ah in this verse has two readings. Abu Ja‘far, Abu ‘Amir, Hamzah, al-Kisa’i and Abu Bakr read it hamiyah with long vowel a. Hamiyah means warm water. The others read it hami’ah meaning musky water. (Ibid.)
Hence, not only do we have a gross scientific error, we also have a clear example that proves that Quran contains variant readings!
The following is an alternate translation of this particular report:
4002. It was narrated that Abu Dharr said: “I was riding behind the messenger of Allah while he was on a donkey, and the sun was setting. He said: ‘Do you know where this (sun) sets?’ I said: ‘Allah and his messenger know best.’ He said: ‘IT SETS IN A SPRING OF WATER (fa innaha taghrubu fi ‘ainin hamiyah).’” (SAHIH) (English Translation of Sunan Abu Dawud, Compiled by Imam Hafiz Abu Dawud Sulaiman bin Ash‘ath – From Hadith no. 3242 to 4350, ahadith edited and referenced by Hafiz Abu Tahir Zubair ‘Ali Za’i, translated by Nasiruddin al-Khattab (Canada), final review by Abu Khaliyl (USA) [Darussalam Publishers & Distributors, First Edition: July, 2008], Volume 4, 29. The Book Of The Recitations And Readings Of The Qur’an, p. 375; capital emphasis ours)
Muhammad was simply repeating the gross mistake of the Quran in regard to Alexander the Great traveling so far east till he found the literal setting place of the sun:
They will question thee concerning Dhool Karnain. Say: ‘I will recite to you a mention of him. We established him in the land, and We gave him a way to everything; and he followed a way until, WHEN HE REACHED THE SETTING OF THE SUN, HE FOUND IT SETTING IN A MUDDY SPRING, and he found nearby a people. We said, ‘O Dhool Karnain, either thou shalt chastise them, or thou shalt take towards them a way of kindness.’ He said, ‘As for the evildoer, him we shall chastise, then he shall be returned to his Lord and He shall chastise him with a horrible chastisement. But as for him who believes, and does righteousness, he shall receive as recompense the reward most fair, and we shall speak to him, of our command, easiness.’ Then he followed a way until, when he reached the rising of the sun, he found it rising upon a people for whom We had not appointed any veil to shade them from it. S. 18:83-90 Arberry
The noted Muslim translator, Abdullah Yusuf Ali, stated in his Quran translation that,
2430. This is the first of the three episodes here mentioned, his expedition to the west. “Reaching the setting of the sun” does not mean the extreme west, for there is no such thing. West and East are relative terms.
It means a western expedition terminated by a “spring of murky water.” This has puzzled Commentators, and they have understood this to mean the dark, tempestuous sea.
If Dhul al Qarnayn is Alexander the Great, the reference is easily understood to be to Lychnitis (now Ochrida), west of Macedonia. It is fed entirely by underground springs in a limestone region, where the water is never very clear. (*; bold emphasis ours)
Saying that this verse where Muhammad has the sun setting in a muddy spring has puzzled Muslim commentators is putting it mildly.
BON APPETIT!
The hadiths teach that Muhammad’s food would praise Allah right before being consumed by Muhammad! Muhammad even caused water to flow from his fingers!
“Narrated ‘Abdullah: We used to consider miracles as Allah’s Blessings, but you people consider them to be a warning. Once we were with Allah’s apostle on a journey, and we ran short of water. He said, ‘Bring the water remaining with you.’ The people brought a utensil containing a little water. He placed his hand in it and said, ‘Come to the blessed water, and the Blessing is from Allah.’ I saw the water flowing from among the fingers of Allah’s apostle, and no doubt, we heard the meal glorifying Allah, when it was being eaten (by him). Vol. 4, Bk. 56, No. 779
This reminds us of a scene from the Three Stooges where Curly’s sandwich kept biting him in his face every time he tried to eat it. In fact, it may be that the reason why Curly’s sandwich kept giving him such a hard time is because he was a disbelieving Jew whereas the sandwich was a Muslim!
FINGER LICKING GOOD
Muhammad forbade his followers from wiping their hands after eating until and unless they or someone else licks them clean!
“Narrated Ibn Abbas: The prophet said, ‘When you eat, do not wipe your hand till you have licked it, or had it licked by somebody else.’” Vol. 7, Bk., No. 366
LIZARDS
Muhammad believed that lizards were cursed, and should therefore be killed, because it was a lizard who blew fire on Abraham in order to kill him!
“Narrated Um Sharik: Allah’s apostle ordered that the salamander should be killed and said, “It (i.e. the salamander) blew (the fire) on Abraham.” Vol. 4, Bk. 55, No. 579
The translator provides this interesting footnote:
“When Ibrahim (Abraham) was thrown into the fire, it is said all animals tried to extinguish the fire except the house lizard which blew it up.”
MARTYRS AS GREEN BIRDS
According to Sheikh Abdullah bin Muhammad bin Hamid of the sacred Mosque of Mecca (Saudi Arabia),
“Allah’s Apostle said: The souls of the martyrs are in the bodies of green birds dwelling in paradise wherever they like.” Vol. 1, p. xxviii
This is confirmed by the following hadith:
It has been narrated on the authority of Masruq Who said: We asked ‘Abdullah about the Qur’anic verse: “Think not of those who are slain in Allah’s way as dead. Nay, they are alive, finding their sustenance in the presence of their Lord” (iii. 169). He said: We asked the meaning of the verse (from the prophet) who said: The souls, of the martyrs live in the bodies of green birds who have their nests in chandeliers hung from the throne of the Almighty. They eat the fruits of Paradise from wherever they like and then nestle in these chandeliers. Once their Lord cast a glance at them and said: Do ye want anything? They said: What more shall we desire? We eat the fruit of Paradise from wherever we like. Their Lord asked them the same question thrice. When they saw that they will continue to be asked and not left (without answering the question), they said: O Lord, we wish that Thou mayest return our souls to our bodies so that we may be slain in Thy way once again. When He (Allah) saw that they had no need, they were left (to their joy in heaven). (Sahih Muslim, Book 020, Number 4651)
THE SIZE OF A PROPHET’S GENERATIVE ORGAN
In what can only be described as tasteless and vulgar street language, the early Islamic commentators record a statement made by Muhammad in regard to John the Baptist’s body parts. This tradition is recorded in Mahmoud Ayoub’s The Quran and its Interpreters, vol. II: The House of Imran:
“… ‘Everyone of the sons of Adam shall come on the day of resurrection with a sin [of sexual impropriety], except Yahya (John the Baptist) b. Zechariah.’ Then, picking up a tiny straw, he continued, ‘This is because HIS GENERATIVE ORGAN WAS NO BIGGER THAN THIS STRAW.’” (Ibid, State University of New York Press (SUNY), Albany, 1992, p. 109; bold and capital emphasis ours)
For a prophet to speak of one’s private part being the size of a tiny straw, even to illustrate a point, is shocking and incredulous. Such language is unbefitting a man whom Muslims say was the greatest prophet and moral example who ever lived. Besides, what other prophet ever spoke of another’s body part in such a fashion?
More importantly, how did Muhammad know how small or large the Baptist’s genitalia were? Are we to assume that Muhammad received a special revelation for this otherwise unknown fact?
Yep, I am ready to believe in this vile women whoring and raping, adulterous stone kisser and false prophet…. NOT!
So you don’t believe in the Bible?
@ Shamoun
You had time to write all that but still haven’t wrote a response to Isra or rabbits not being rudiments?
Could’ve gone to the gym
Lool. He is trying so desperetly to bash Islam. I mean does he really think that people will sit here and read through his copy pastes? He knows this is not allowed on the blog where you copy paste entire ‘articles’ but does it anyway just to give the impression we will be amazed by his verbal diarrhea. The level of patheticness of this blob is unbelieveble.
The reason why ‘Rabbits’ aren’t Kosher is because they don’t have split hooves… Which is true… Rabbits also ‘rechew’ . I think you mean ‘ruminant’ ,btw. This is all assuming that ‘ Arnevet’ means rabbit, which we aren’t certain is the case..
Who wants to let Anthony know the real facts about rabbits? Anyone? Stew? Atlas? Walch?
Who wants to let ‘quranbibleblog’ know he can respond? Anyone? Stew? Anyone? Bueller?
LOL, I am just playing with you Anthony, because you are using arguments that have already been refuted. You haven’t looked at this issue with a critical eye and just believe what you have been told.
Here you go: https://quranandbibleblog.wordpress.com/2018/12/07/on-rabbits-and-rumination-a-response-to-christian-interpretations-of-leviticus-115-6/
Oh and this too: https://quranandbibleblog.wordpress.com/2019/07/19/biologos-on-scientific-errors-in-the-bible-a-review/
Well, since I’m not a Christian, your link has no relevance to me. But I’m charitable towards the ignorant, so I’ll make the argument for you: ‘Rabbits are not ruminants, hence the Torah is wrong’ . Which would be a fantastic argument if Vayiqra referred to Ruminants, which it doesn’t. Rabbits ‘redigest’ and ‘rechew’ Yes, they’re don’t have extra chambers in their stomachs, but the verses say ‘rechew’ which is a description of an act, not a scientific explanation of digestion. This ain’t that difficult to understand
Obviously, you didn’t read the articles. And before you accuse others of ignorance, be sure you are not yourself.
Rabbits don’t “rechew” anything. That would defeat the purpose. Read the articles and fix your own ignorance first.
P.S., I love it when atheists/agnostics/nones (I assume you are one of these) get involved in religious debates and try to take sides as if their opinions matter.
Nor do rabbits “redigest”. Again, educate yourself first, then speak. Right now, you are showcasing your ignorance.
@ QB
I believe he’s Jewish
@ Anthony
The reason given in the Pentateuch one is because they chew the cud. Also are you arguing that Arnevet doesn’t mean hare?
Ah, I see, My apologies.
No… I’m neither Atheist or Agnostic. You make a lot of incorrect assumptions. I notice that you have no problem asserting ‘difficulties’ with other texts, but let’s see how you do when the situation is reversed. I answered you, so I’m curious. Ashura,which Muslims today celebrate as a day of fasting, was copied from the Jews. God doesn’t tell Muhammad the significance of the 10th of the new year, Muhammad has to ask Jews. Why is that? And now it’s a Muslim ‘holy day’ . A bit bizarre.
@ Anthony
It appears you are trying to deflect from the original disscussion concerning the Pentateuch? I think one shpuld finish a candy bar before opening another.
Hi, Stew. I’ll go along with ‘rabbit’ for the discussion, though we really aren’t sure. Hare is a possibility, but there was disagreement among the commentators. The identification of many of the animals listed in Leviticus is uncertain. Usually the English translations ,though giving a translation, mention this in footnotes
Stew… I already answered. My answer was very clear. If you can’t understand it, that’s not my problem. None of you ANY Hebrew and it shows
So I guess you will not be reading the articles then. Ok, I understand. You are clearly not willing to listen to other points of view other than your own. But whether you accept it or not, you are clearly wrong about rabbits “rechewing”. They do not. Hence, yes, the Bible is wrong. I’m sorry. I don’t mean to hurt your feelings.
As for Ashura, so what? Things were revealed gradually.
@ Anthony
I’ve heard the answer and never claimed to know Hebrew (seeing as its a dead language that you had to use our lexicons to try and revive and all that) you claimed this may not be a hare or rabbit cool let’s run with this:
1. Then what is this creature that God has forbidden? You should go get some rabbit then and eat it as there is no basis for it not being kosher.
2. More fundamentally if you can’t identify what any animals are then how does one know what is and is not forbidden? For example, we all know pork is forbidden but what else? The lack of the preservation of classical Hebrew is further proof the Torah was not meant for eternity.
Quranblog:) . . I was about to to reply and say something to you and Stew, but your last post was not what I expected. So, I’ll let it go… We’ll agree to disagree
Stew…. I’m gonna focus on you and leave Quranblog out of this. You are a complete ignoramus regarding Judaism and Hebrew, so it’s impossible to have an in depth discussion regarding Hebrew and its preservation,etc… This is not an ad hominem, as I’m gonna prove right now that you can’t read ANY HEBREW.
@ Anthony
And? I mean it shows how weak he is. He literally goes around slapping babies and whispering at sleeping people lol. I fail to see your argument that’s like saying why did God allow Satan to afflict Job (as) in his family, health etc. Let’s see how ‘powerful’ he is:
1. His f*ckboy moments:
When they are all brought before Him, the weak will say to those who were arrogant and sought greatness: “We were your followers. Are you able to save us from God’s punishment today?” They will reply: “If God had guided us, we would’ve guided you. It makes no difference now whether we lose it or are patient, there is no escape…” When everything has been decided, Satan will say: “God gave you a true promise and I too made promises but they were lies. All I did was invite you to do things, I had no control whatsoever over you. You responded to my call, so don’t blame me, only blame yourselves. I’m not going to ask you for help nor should you ask me. I reject the way you associated me with God before. A bitter suffering awaits those that did such wrong…” (Q. 14:21-22)
Don’t be like the ones who came out of their homes arrogantly and showing off to people, blocking themselves and others from God’s path because God has completely encircled everything they’re up too. Like when Satan made the little good that they’ve done alluring to them and told them: “No one can defeat you this day, because I will be right beside you…” but when the armies saw one another ran away, saying: “This is where I leave you, I can see what you don’t! I fear God because God is severe in giving punishment!” (Q 8:47-48)
They’re like the people who suffered before them. They tasted the consequences of their actions, and ˹in the end˺ they’ll have a painful punishment. Like when Satan says to a person: “Disbelieve,” then, when they’ve disbelieved, says: “I have nothing to do with you! I fear God the Lord of all realms!” So the outcome for both of them is that they will be the Fire, remaining together in it for all eternity. That is the reimbursement for those who do wrong. (Q 59:15-17)
Yeah we’re all trembling in our boots at his power lol. Continuing on:
2.Some of the dialogue when he was banished:
I said to him: “Get out from here! You are an Outcast! Have no doubts My curse is on you until the Day of Judgement!” Satan said: “My Lord, just grant me more time until the Day when they’re resurrected!” I said: “You are now of those who have been given more time.” And he responded: “I swear on YOUR might! I will mislead all, except your chosen and most sincere servants!” I replied: “This is the Truth, and the Truth is all I say, I will fill Hell with YOU and all those that FOLLOW YOU…” (Q 38:77-84)
I replied: “Go, and whoever follows you from among them, then Hell is your reward. A reward that will be repaid in full. Make whoever you can slip with your whisper and march both your cavalry and infantry. Participate with them in both their money and children. And make to them all kinds of promises.” But whatever Satan promises is nothing but deception…”As for My servants, you have no authority over them…” And your Lord is enough to look after your affairs. (Q 17:63-65)
Notice two things, one he was scared and two the Lord allowed him as a test. Which brings us to:
3. His eventual punishment in Hell and only doing as God willed:
The idol worshippers call on their ‘females’ in His place, when they actually call on no one besides Satan, the one who goes above and beyond in his crimes. The same one who God has laid His curse on… He makes them promises and arouses false hopes and passions, but the Devil’s promises are nothing but a deception. Such people will have Hell for their home and they will find no escape from it. (Q 4:117-121)
But does the forgetful human being not remember that I created them before when they were nothing to begin with? So I swear by your Lord, I will gather them along with Satan and bring them crawling on their knees around Hell.Then I will snatch out from each denomination those who were the most disobedient, who will then stand against the Most Merciful. Then, it’s I who knows best which of them will be the first to be seared. (Q 19:67-70)
I didn’t send any Messenger or Prophet before you except that when he said something, Satan threw some sort of misunderstanding into it. But God will put an end to that which Satan throws in; then God will make His verses precise, because God is All Knowing and ever Wise. This is so He can make what Satan threw in a test for those whose hearts are sick ˹or˺ hard, because those who do wrong are argumentative, and so that those who were given knowledge will come to realize that it is the Truth from your Lord and believe, and humble their hearts in submission to it. And have no doubts, God is the Guide to the straight path for those who have faith, but those who disbelieve will never stop being in doubt about this until the Hour suddenly approaches them or the punishment of a desolate Day befalls them. That Day the Kingdom is God’s and He will judge between them all… (Q.22:52-56)
Now with that out the way on to your next set:
To begin he may not have neccessarily been projected on the Cross that is the opion of a disciple of Prophet Muhammad who we know read gnostic books. God schemes to continue evil people who will not change along their evil path:
…He misguides many… and He guides many… but He only misguides those who are disobedient and corrupt. (Q. 2:26)
Moving on your laughing but…
Jews waiting for Elijah(as) (even going as far as fixing a place at the table every year for him) and better yet the Messiah(as). Oy vey indeed…
”are you a idiot?
Sahih International: From the evil of that which He created
did the jews seek protection from hitler? was hitler evil? in the torah why are their forces which seem powerful than yhwh?”
The idiot argument is persuasive, but I’m still not convinced:)
Your argument is thus: ‘ Satan/demons aren’t powerful. God created them’
You think this helps your argument? Allah creates demons and satan, then tells Muhammad to pray for protection from the evil that Allah created? A more effective method of protection would have been not creating them
”
You think this helps your argument? Allah creates demons and satan, then tells Muhammad to pray for protection from the evil that Allah created? A more effective method of protection would have been not creating them”
you mean it would have been better for adonai not to have created hitler? or the canaanite women and children? wouldn’t that have been better? God can create what he wills, this means NOTHING which is CREATED has INHERENT power in it, which SHAFTS your initial bs. God has power over all things.
Stew, I think you replied to the wrong post. You seem awfully pissed off. You okay?
”And? I mean it shows how weak he is. He literally goes around slapping babies and whispering at sleeping people lol. I fail to see your argument that’s like saying why did God allow Satan to afflict Job (as) in his family, health etc. Let’s see how ‘powerful’ he is:
1. His f*ckboy moments:”””
Huh? Yeesh
‘To begin he may not have neccessarily been projected on the Cross that is the opion of a disciple of Prophet Muhammad who we know read gnostic books. God schemes to continue evil people who will not change along their evil path:
…He misguides many… and He guides many… but He only misguides those who are disobedient and corrupt. (Q. 2:26)”
Well, when Muslims find out what actually happened, let me know.:) . Have a good day:)
(((Stew, I think you replied to the wrong post. You seem awfully pissed off. You okay?
Well, when Muslims find out what actually happened, let me know.:) . Have a good day:))))
Translation: I have no answer since I got so badly refuted and so now I’ll try and save face by throwing out these pathetic statements which have zero refutations in them and pretend I have the upper hand.
There you go, translated that ‘Hebrew’ for ya. No need to thank me.
sure, this is his refutation and explanation of what happened to Jesus… I’ll quote him
”To begin he may not have neccessarily been projected on the Cross that is the opion of a disciple of Prophet Muhammad who we know read gnostic books. God schemes to continue evil people who will not change along their evil path:”
His refutation is
1- Muslims don’t know what happened, so it’s not fair to say the image f Jesus was projected onto the cross. Maybe that happened, but who knows
2- An affirmation that God is a deceiver.
Stew is just making my case for me… The first half of his post is vulgar and bizarre.. Here’s a quote comparing the Islamic Satan with….
‘1. His f*ckboy moments:”’
Btw, if Satan is so powerless, then why is there a Surah in the Quran that instructs Muhammad to supplicate for protection from demonic entities? Seems like the author of the Quran held a different view than the posters here.
“Btw, if Satan is so powerless, then why is there a Surah in the Quran that instructs Muhammad to supplicate for protection from demonic entities? Seems like the author of the Quran held a different view than the posters here.”
are you a idiot?
Sahih International: From the evil of that which He created
did the jews seek protection from hitler? was hitler evil? in the torah why are their forces which seem powerful than yhwh?
“2- An affirmation that God is a deceiver.”
who made it appear ? you jews. you went around telling people that you got the job done. so you are the ones who went around deceiving people.
Anthony, think Stew showed convincingly that your initial claim about Satan being “all-powerful” is inaccurate. That would be like me saying that since the angel was able to kill thousands of Assyrians in a single night, it is “all-powerful”. But only God is “All-Powerful”. The angel, like Satan, is able to do things only with God’s permission. If God decreed that Satan could not do anything and be completely powerless, then that’s how it would be. Satan knows this. He also knows that he is doomed to hell for eternity:
It is narrated on the authority of Abu Huraira that when, the son of Adam recites the Ayat of Sajdah (prostration) and then falls down in prostration, the Satan goes into seclusion and weeps and says:
Alas, and in the narration of Abu Kuraib the words are: Woe unto me, the son of Adam was commanded to prostrate, and he prostrated and Paradise was entitled to him and I was commanded to prostrate, but I refused and am doomed to Hell. (Sahih Muslim)
This doesn’t sound like an “all-powerful” being, does it?
((((Btw, if Satan is so powerless, then why is there a Surah in the Quran that instructs Muhammad to supplicate for protection from demonic entities? Seems like the author of the Quran held a different view than the posters here.))))
Let me (an insignificant goy) slowly explain it to you o mighty jew.
Praying for protection from satanic influence doesn’t implicate in any way him being ‘powerful’.
There is more chance that a random person on the street can do me (or an atheist) more harm than satan can by just walking up to me (or the atheist) and stabbing me (or the atheist) to death. Does that make this random tom, dick or harry ‘powerful’? Not really.
”are you a idiot?
Sahih International: From the evil of that which He created
did the jews seek protection from hitler? was hitler evil? in the torah why are their forces which seem powerful than yhwh?”
The idiot argument is persuasive, but I’m still not convinced:)
Your argument is thus: ‘ Satan/demons aren’t powerful. God created them’
You think this helps your argument? Allah creates demons and satan, then tells Muhammad to pray for protection from the evil that Allah created? A more effective method of protection would have been not creating them
Sam you sound angry… did you get beat up by Muslims when you were a young fruitcake ?
Or are you upset that Watson didnt give you a reach around this weekend?
Poor grumpy fat bald Shameless Shamu Shamoun
… and in the end we resort to ad hominems. No surprise no one is interested in your parody of a religion.
Oh I don’t know about the bulge. Our religion seems to be doing just fine despite the antics of random trolls.
@ Helge
Sam is the one doing ad hominem and gisp gallops. Also pretty sure nobody is interested in Christianity which us dying a sad , lonely death to secularism but whatever.
@Helge Beck
Only thing that is a parody is that shitfest you call your life.
Instead of posting on here why dont you do something productive like pick up my uber eats order and deliver it to me.
Christians have no fear of hell or death. Islam is 600 years too late and a false religion, therefore that warning has nothing true in it.
It is a hallow warning.
Christianity came too late after the Tanakh, which doesn’t even mention the afterlife, let alone hell. So Christianity is a false religion, and therefore any warning of hell has nothing true in it.
Plus, the Bible is a book of contradictions, errors, and absurdities. So any warning of hell is a hollow warning.
The intertextuality of both the OT and NT (prophesies, quotes, allusions, fulfillments) proves that you are wrong. Plus the Qur’an affirms all the previous Scriptures and Muslims have NEVER been able to deal with it. (Surah 5:47; 5:68; 10:94; 3:1-3; 2:136; 29:46)
It is you Faizy who is an angry clown who violates his own religion (Surah 29:46).
Blah, blah, blah. Pennywise, your salesman mantra means nothing to people of knowledge. There is no “intertextuality” between the Tanakh and the NT. They are 2 different collections of books written by anonymous potatoes with competing and contradictory theologies. The Bible copied from the local cultures (e.g., the heavenly court in Daniel is borrowed from Canaanite mythology; so is the myth of Leviathan [Lotan in Canaanite myth]).
Even Genesis 6:4 reeks of pagan mythology. In those myths, the gods could impregnate humans. The verse also speaks of the “heroes of old”. That sounds a lot like the Greek myths of Hercules and such. LOL!!
@ Ken.
Wrong.
Jesus told his followers to fear God who can throw you into hell:
“Don’t be afraid of those who want to kill your body; they cannot touch your soul. Fear only God, who can destroy both soul and body in hell.”
Matthew 10:28.
You left out the context of Matthew 10:26-31.
26 “Therefore do not fear them [ unbelievers like you], for there is nothing concealed that will not be revealed, or hidden that will not be known. 27 What I tell you in the darkness, speak in the light; and what you hear whispered in your ear, proclaim upon the housetops. 28 Do not fear those who kill the body but are unable to kill the soul; but rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell. 29 Are not two sparrows sold for a cent? And yet not one of them will fall to the ground apart from your Father. 30 But the very hairs of your head are all numbered. 31 So do not fear; you are more valuable than many sparrows.
Of course believers are to continue to fear / respect God. But if they are true believers, Jesus says that we don’t have that fear of hell. Jesus says the true believers, like us Christians, are loved by Him, more valuable than sparrows and He has numbered our very hairs on our head. (will protect us, knows about all our sufferings, etc.)
Yes, God is able to send people to hell – it is a warning to be careful and make sure you are a true believer in Him – unlike you who turned his back on Jesus and that verse, along with Matthew 7:21-23 falls upon you.
Jesus says to you who claimed to be believers but you proved you are not a believer – “I never knew you, depart from Me, you who practice wickedness.”
Jesus of the NT says to you, Paul, “I never knew you”. Your conversion to Islam proves you never were born again nor had the Holy Spirit, etc.
Since you also affirm liberal scholarship of thinking 2 Tim. and 2 Peter are forgeries, and you pour hatred upon the holy and sacred texts of 2 Timothy 3:16 and 2 Peter 1:19-21 – you prove that you never knew the LORD God Himself.
“Of course believers are to continue to fear / respect God. But if they are true believers, Jesus says that we don’t have that fear of hell. Jesus says the true believers, like us Christians, are loved by Him, more valuable than sparrows and He has numbered our very hairs on our head. (will protect us, knows about all our sufferings, etc.)”
Jesus said that true believes can move mountains:
“He replied, “Because you have so little faith. Truly I tell you, if you have faith as small as a mustard seed, you can say to this mountain, ‘Move from here to there,’ and it will move.Nothing will be impossible for you.”” – Matthew 17:20
“Jesus replied, “Truly I tell you, if you have faith and do not doubt, not only can you do what was done to the fig tree, but also you can say to this mountain, ‘Go, throw yourself into the sea,’ and it will be done.” – Matthew 21:21
Since you cannot do these things, I assume that means you have no real faith. Bummer, Pennwise…
Ken I was a Christian who thought just as you did. But by the grace of God I left behind the falsehoods of fundamentalism. I pray one day you will too.
But it takes a lot of humility..
“Jesus says that we don’t have that fear of hell. Jesus says the true believers, like us Christians, are loved by Him, more valuable than sparrows and He has numbered our very hairs on our head. (”
dont be an idiot. your jesus as “fully god and fully man” was stinking his load and asked repeatedly “move this cup”
the COWARD talked about lack of faith, but when it came to his time, cried like a cry baby “please daddy move the cup”
Hell is a horrible place
My point is that you crosstians should have fear and be troubled by.the thought of hell and entering it. jebus was troubled by 6 HOURS on a cross REGARDLESS of all the “faith” he had.
think about it, if man-god shit his load, then what about an american white land grabber unable to move mountains ?
“Of course believers are to continue to fear / respect God. But if they are true believers, Jesus says that we don’t have that fear of hell.”
lol, kafir, let me remind you that you are on EARTH NOT IN HEAVEN .
punishment is GODS DOING
you think u r a true believer ? then go and ask for death, why want the enjoyment of money, cars, sinful life ? Go out and live in a card board and give up all your money. Give your house back to the indians. dont wash your hands. you maggots .
go on “true believer”
the new testament is a filthy book of lies and contradictions.
just look at the theme the gospel of john follows
“I am COMMANDED what to say”
“I and the father r one”
“here comes the lamb who takes away sin”
john again and again emphasise that jebus was a person who would not BEG his god REPEATEDLY and get NO ANSWER.
john is clearly fixing jesus to suit johns view of jesus
Comment: john clearly has his jesus in control and know exactly the mind of the father, but mark has his jesus not have the intimate connection (“take AWAY the cup” )and begs REPEATEDLY, meaning he thinks there is a WAY out, which MEANS he DOESNT know WHILE in the STATE of begging. john cannot have any of this
“i and the father r one”
“my father COMMANDS me what to say”
not the markan jesus who Begs to be saved.
Quote:
John 12.27-28a: 27 “Now My soul has become troubled; and what shall I say, ‘Father, save Me from this hour’? But for this purpose I came to this hour. 28a Father, glorify Your name.”
The point is to allow Jesus to affirm that he is not going to beg for his life, even conditionally. John is correcting Mark and the other synoptics, in my judgment. There is no “real” trouble in John; he feels troubled only to allow him to demonstrate his control and composure.
::::
i find it funny that ken base his faith on johns FIXED jesus
The Qur’an seems to contradict that Hadith that Paul gave at the beginning, in the post.
I always why Paul W. does not give the exact reference of Hadith when putting them up.
“Verily, those who have attained to faith, as well as those who follow the Jewish faith, and the Christians, and the Sabaeans—all who believe in God and the last day and do righteous deeds, shall have their reward with their Sustainer; and no fear need they have, and neither shall they grieve.” [Qur’an, Surah 2:62, 5:69]
This only “contradicts” if you are a clown named Pennywise. This verse is referring to people who believed in the true messages of the prophets before Islam, not the followers of false religions like Christianity/
That is not what the texts of the Qur’an says. It is you who are a clown and “Pennywise” – you are just an angry nutball.
HAHAHAHA, there goes poor Pennywise with his whining! I knew that would happen!
The text of the Quran is clear that only Islam is accepted by God now that it has been revealed. Before Islam, if a person followed the true message of the prophets, he will be saved.
The prophet said, ‘Satan urinated in his ears.’” Vol. 2, Bk. 21, No. 245
LOL – what a nutty and backwards religion that thinks Satan is like a human being and can urinate or fart (other Hadith), etc.
satan is a creature, and as such has bodily functions in common with others.
He is a spirit creature; a fallen angel – therefore, he has no physical bodily functions. This is enough to discredit Islam.
“When human beings began to increase in number on the earth and daughters were born to them, the sons of God saw that the daughters of humans were beautiful, and they married any of them they chose.”
LOL, horny fallen angels…
“The Nephilim were on the earth in those days—and also afterward—when the sons of God went to the daughters of humans and had children by them. They were the heroes of old, men of renown.” (Genesis 6:4)
“One day the angels [sons of God] came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan also came with them. The Lord said to Satan, “Where have you come from?”” (Job 1:6-7)
“It is for this reason that a woman ought to have authority over her own head, because of the angels.” (1 Corinthians 11:10)
LOL – what a nutty and backwards religion thinks that angels are like human beings and can impregnate human beings, etc.
Talking of backward religion
Is it true that if a person does not say “Bismillah” before having intercourse with their spouse, then Satan shares with him in that?
Answer (by Shaikh Muhammad S. al-Munajjid):
With regard to the Satan having a share when one does not say “Bismillah” Allah says, “and become a partner in their wealth and their children and promise them. But Satan does not promise them except delusion.” (17:64). Al-Qurtubi said, “Give yourself a share in that…”
5. The fifth view was narrated from Mujahid who said, “If a man has intercourse and does not mention the name of Allah, the Jinn wraps himself around his penis and has intercourse along with him. This is what is referred to in the verse, “untouched before them by man or Jinn”. (55:56) (Tafseer al Qurtubi)
Conclusion
The correct view of the meaning of this verse is that it should be interpreted in the ways mentioned above, for there is no contradiction between these meanings. Each of the scholars mentioned one aspect of its meanings, and there is no contradiction between them.
The basic principle in such a case is that the verse should be interpreted according to all its meanings. Ibn Taymiyyah said, “Most of the differences narrated from the Salaf (pious predecessors) in authentic reports have to do with variations, not contradictions.
Allah knows bes
Monday 03/03/2003
http://WWW.ISLAMWEB.NET
As he double posted I’ll repost my response here as well:
I think the only thing amazing here is your lack of reading comprehension first this was not even related to the discussion. The argument presented by Ken Temple was that Angels don’t eat and therefore Islam is wrong. And this was proven not to be true as stated by early Christian scholars and Biblical text.
Next, because your links don’t work I’ll post it:
https://www.islamweb.net/ehajj/printarticle.php?id=36372&lang=E
Munajjid is giving commentary of scholar OPINIONS (i.e. something we can choose to agree or disagree with) of the passage:
17:64. “Make whoever you can slip with your whisper and march both your cavalry and infantry. Participate with them in both their money and CHILDREN. And make to them all kinds of promises.” But whatever Satan promises is nothing but deception…
17:65. “As for My servants, you have no authority over them…” And your Lord is enough to look after your affairs.
He then states:
The following are what some scholars said about the interpretation of the word children:
1. Regarding “children”, it was said that this means the children of Zina (fornication, adultery). This was the view of Mujahid, al-Dhahhak and Abdullah Ibn Abbas.
2. It was also narrated that he said, “It refers to the children whom they killed and against whom they committed other crimes.”
3. It was also narrated that he said, “This refers to when they call them by names such as Abdul-Harith, Abdul-Uzza (i.e., names meaning “slave of…” referring to their false gods).”
4. It was also said that this refers to their initiating their children into disbelief and this was the view of Qatadah.
5. The fifth view was narrated from Mujahid who said, “If a man has intercourse and does not mention the name of Allah, the Jinn wraps himself around his penis and has intercourse along with him. This is what is referred to in the verse, “untouched before them by man or Jinn”. (55:56) (Tafseer al Qurtubi)
Ibn Katheer said, “Share with them wealth and children (by tempting them to earn money by illegal ways, usury, or by committing illegal sexual intercourse.”
“Children,” al-Awfi said, narrating from Ibn Abbas, Mujahid and al-Dhahhak, “means the children of Zina (fornication, adultery). Ali ibn Abi Talhah said, narrating from Ibn Abbas, “This refers to their children whom they used to kill from folly, without knowledge. Qatadah said, narrating from al-Hasan al-Basri, “By Allah, he had a share with them in their children by making them non-Muslims, so that they followed a religion other than the religion of Allah and gave a share of their wealth to the Satan.”
Ibn Jareer said, “The most correct view is that every child who is born of a woman concerning whom a sin is committed by giving him a name which Allah dislikes, or by initiating him into a religion other than that with which Allah is pleased, or by committing adultery with his mother, or by killing him, or by burying him or her alive, or other actions which involve sin and disobedience towards Allah, all come under the heading of the Satan having a share in that with the one to whom the child is born, because in the verse ‘share with them wealth and children’ Allah did not specify one meaning to the exclusion of any other. Every case where Allah is disobeyed and the Satan is obeyed is a form of his sharing in that.
So you have ONE scholar who was of the opinion of what you quoted and since he quoted nothing to prove that opinion we are not bound to it.
Wrong, he is a creature that can technically impregnate human beings, just like the sons of God in Genesis 6:4. Satan was among the sons of God in Job 1.
wrong. the interpretation you bring of the Genesis 6 passage is proved wrong by Jesus, Al Masih.
Mark 12:25, Matthew 22:30; Luke 20:35-36
“there is no marriage (nor sex) in heaven; they are like the angels in heaven”
the phrase “sons of God” just mean human males who follow God; and “the daughters of men” just means female humans who were not following God (they were worldly, human-centered only – from “men”, “human”, not spiritually minded) – these were beautiful women who seduced the godly men / males who followed God.
The “Nephilim” are just extra-ordinarily large and powerful and gifted people – humans. = “mighty ones”, “warriors”. Later, the Hebrew spies compared the Canaanites and their warriors to the “Nephilim” in Numbers 13:29-33 – the fears that the Hebrews had of the Canaanites and other nations was mixed in with the fear and exaggeration that they displayed. There is nothing in the text that tells us that there some kind of hybrid being from demons and humans.
“Given the exaggerated tone of the spies account, their reference to the Nephilim is most likely an expression of their fear and an excuse for their disobedience, rather than an accurate statement indicating that the Nephilim were still living after the flood.” (page 286, ESV Study Bible)
LOL, who cares what the NT says dummy? This is just another contradiction in your silly religion.
The “sons of God” cannot be mere human beings because the verse explicitly says that they saw the “daughters of humans” and married them. If they are humans, it is redundant to say that they were attracted to other humans. Who else would they be attracted to? The sons of animals? LOL!!
Plus, this was not in heaven moron. This was on earth. So, the “sons of God” (bene Elohim) were able to procreate on earth.
The Hebrew phrase is only used in the Bible to refer to angels. Look it up Pennywise. You have been refuted.
Ken, I can write for you how Islam and in amazing way has detailed things for us about creations whether they are human beings, Jinn whom satan is from, and angels. How can we understand the Jinn’s world and its dimension. Do Jinn including satan need to eat or not? Do Angels need that? Who are addressed by God’s commands which involve punishing and rewarding? Christianity and Judaism blend and mix many concepts with each others, and they lack the clarity regarding alot of things! And we know what christians ended up believing in. You need Islam to understand this universe and to clarify things for you. However, I’m not gonna waste my time with one who doesn’t listen.
But seriously, do you really have an issue that satan, a created being, because he urinates while in the same time you believe stupidly that The Almighty God used to urinate and defecate on this earth? Seriously?
“Who cares what the NT says” ?
The Quran affirms the book of Christians, so you are wrong.
Surah 5:68
10:94
5:47
You are the dummy for your own religion refutes itself.
affirming injeel, not the reconstructed modern day bibles.
the quran in 5:68 clearly says that the injeel AGREES with it, how can you be so f–in dumb not to see this?
Quran does not think the injeel = the dying and rising yhwh god.
why is their a disease in your heart and when are you going to ask for death , leave your riches, eat maggots, live in cardboard, sell your clothes and try to speak at least arabic language to show how holy ghoat moves your tongue ?
jesus thought that FAITH gives crosstians the POWER TO command mountains to their doom and:
“Very truly, I tell you, the one who believes in me will also do the works that I do and, in fact, will do greater works than these, because I am going to the Father. I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. If in my name you ask me for anything, I will do it.”
your pagan comic book should give you the power to have discussion in arabic better than jesus spoke aramaic. So when u going to make a youtube video of yourself showing your “GREATER THAN” miracles?
Moron, stop deflecting. You got refuted so you whine and deflect like the clown you are. Genesis 6 refers to angels having sex with humans. That’s what it says. You’re too embarrassed by it and so resort to pathetic interpretations.
wrong. the interpretation you bring of the Genesis 6 passage is proved wrong by Jesus, Al Masih.
Mark 12:25, Matthew 22:30; Luke 20:35-36
“there is no marriage (nor sex) in heaven; they are like the angels in heaven”
A truth repeated in all three synoptic gospels is not “deflecting”. Jesus Al Masih is Lord and commands you to submit to Him.
His interpretation tells us how to understand the Genesis 6 passage.
I cannot help it if the Quran contradicts itself.
Mindlessly repeating the same argument just shows what a moron you are. The Tanakh came before your NT and it said nothing of the sort. Plus, for most of early Christian history, Genesis 6 was interpreted as referring to angels. Get over it. You’re just too embarrassed to admit the facts.
And again, Pennywise, Genesis 6 refers to earth not heaven. So whatever your pathetic NT says is irrelevant.
I cannot help it that your Bible is such a mess.
The satan in Job 1 functions as a prosecutor and is differentiated from the ‘sons of God.’ Satan in the Hebrew Bible is not a supernatural being who can unilaterally cause harm. The Islamic ‘Satan’ who is an all-powerful ‘dark lord’ is an idea which was inherited from Christianity
@ Anthony
I wish you didn’t comment in our religion without understanding it. Satan is not an “all-powerful dark lord” nor does he have any authority or power. This is dualism and is complete idolatry as this would mean God has a rival or something happens outside of His will. Satan is essentially a “bad friend” who whispers into people’s ears. God allows him to do this as a way of testing the people and he is aware he will be punished in Hell and just wants to take people with him out of arrogance.
Meanwhile, a lot of your concepts of God (like “the End of Days” description of white hair and potentially YHWH itself) was inherited from Babylonian paganism.
“I wish you didn’t comment in our religion without understanding it. Satan is not an “all-powerful dark lord” nor does he have any authority or power. This is dualism and is complete idolatry as this would mean God has a rival or something happens outside of His will. Satan is essentially a “bad friend” who whispers into people’s ears. God allows him to do this as a way of testing the people and he is aware he will be punished in Hell and just wants to take people with him out of arrogance.”
i was going to write something similar, but then i thought “whats the point” ? thanks stew.
Stew, you’re pretty active here.
Satan is a ‘bad friend?
http://sunnah.com/bukhari/60/102
‘Abu Huraira said, “I heard Allah’s Messenger (ﷺ) saying, ‘There is none born among the off-spring of Adam, but Satan touches it. A child therefore, cries loudly at the time of birth because of the touch of Satan, except Mary and her child.” ‘
A pretty powerful friend
http://sunnah.com/bukhari/19/23
‘Allah’s Messenger (ﷺ) said, “Satan puts three knots at the back of the head of any of you if he is asleep. On every knot he reads and exhales the following words, ‘The night is long, so stay asleep.’ ‘
Satan sure seems powerful in Islam. Also, why couldn’t God make sure that Jesus prevailed against his opponents? Why does God have to scheme and deceive? Instead of projecting the image of Jesus onto a crucified criminal, why not have him defeat his opponents? Muslims and Christians: both waiting for Jesus to return. Oy vey.
Quranblog, I haven’t thought about it too much,but I think the Christian interpretation is convoluted. The ‘divine council’ is spoken of the Hebrew Bible. Not sure why Christians find this so difficult, since they already believe in angels and demons
“Why does God have to scheme and deceive?”
Why are you making things up?
https://youtu.be/H0dCrerCvGg
so why didnt you atleast check before speaking about this?
As Stew pointed out, Anthony does not understand the Islamic concept of “Satan”.
Regardless, Anthony, do you acknowledge that the “sons of God” in Genesis 6 and Job 1 were heavenly beings and not human beings, as Christians like Ken mindless assert?
@ QB
Ooohhhh…yeah is Ken right that the “sons of God” are human beings? Let’s watch how everything meshes so well together over thousands of years…blah, blah, blah missionary propaganda, blah, blah, blah.
Anthony,
You have some interesting comments.
Satan is not a supernatural being ?
Does Judaism teach that the Satan of Job 1-2 and Zechariah 3:1-5 is the same spirit being as the one who tempted Eve in Genesis 3:1-8, who came in the form of a snake / serpent ?
He is the accuser and the tempter toward sin.
Ezekiel chapter 28 seems to indicate he is a fallen cherub (a kind of angel) who fell away because of his pride and arrogance of his beauty and wisdom. (see especially verse 13 – “you were in Eden, the garden of God” – implies he is the one who tempted Eve. verse 14 – you were the anointed cherub, etc. verses 11-17 are key that seems to show he is the spirit behind the pride and arrogance and injustice of evil political leaders, like the king of Tyre – 28:1-5, 11; also the spirit behind the king of Babylon in Isaiah 14:4-14
The NT gives us more insight into who he is.
It is not “mindless repetition”, rather thinking and reasoning and repeating truth, since truth never changes.
wrong. the interpretation you bring of the Genesis 6 passage is proved wrong by Jesus, Al Masih.
spirit beings cannot have sex, or do bodily functions like urinate or fart. (islamic Hadiths – superstition)
Mark 12:25, Matthew 22:30; Luke 20:35-36 (three synoptic Gospels teach this – the historical Jesus Al Masih, not the 600 year late false religion (Islam) that did not know the Jesus of history and a subjective book (Qur’an) of one man’s human claim that turned out to be false; and turns out to be full of superstition and violence and aggressive warfare of injustice – Jihad, Qatal, Harb)
“there is no marriage (nor sex) in heaven; they are like the angels in heaven”
A truth repeated in all three synoptic gospels is not “deflecting”. Jesus Al Masih is Lord and commands you to submit to Him.
His interpretation tells us how to understand the Genesis 6 passage.
Another acceptable interpretation is that these are humans males who are possessed by demons – and that would seem to agree with Jude 6-8.
I cannot help it if the Quran contradicts itself.
“spirit beings cannot have sex, or do bodily functions like urinate or fart.”
a god impregnated his mother and poped out of vagina fully god and fully man, how did that work out?
a spirit CAST jesus out into the wilderness
christian women FEEL the “holy ghost”
jesus was wrong.
explain how the UNCREATED created himself and farted like you do ? remember that you believe yhwh EXISTED AS a man. EXISTED EXISTED
“Personally I tend to think the further back you go (generally) the more likely people believed Yahweh and his angels were actually anthropomorphic….”
pennywise it would explain yhwhs heavenly nostrils smelling a good barbecue
https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRoLYFmOnO5vK1qNo_DQt3zpNCRjKlG666astXQvVwPEIl8pw0A
i googled ken temple
😂🤣 Pennywise hasn’t aged a bit!
😂🤣 Still mindlessly repeating the same garbage? Genesis 6 refers to angels getting it on with humans ON EARTH you pathetic dingbat!
Your silly NT came too late. Sorry. Angels could procreate according to the Tanakh. And your NT doesn’t refute this argument anyway because Genesis 6 was on earth. Get that point through your monkey brain.
Sons of God (bene Elohim) is used only for angels, as per Genesis 6 and Job 1.
Plus, your church fathers believed that Genesis 6 referred to angels as well:
“The Early Church Fathers Justin Martyr, Irenaeus, Athenagoras, Tertullian, Lactantius, Eusebius, Ambrose all accepted the angel interpretation. The Early Church Fathers said “the angels transgressed, and were captivated by love of women and begat children who are called giants”. This is recorded in Vol. 8, pp. 85 and 273 of The Ante-Nicene Fathers. Only after the Fifth Century do we find any interpretation other than angels (fallen angels) for the “sons of God” or beney ‘elohim.” (http://www.fallenangels-ckquarterman.com/tag/ante-nicene-fathers/)
@ QB
The Example of the Church!!!
😉
@ QB
You know I read the passage Ken quoted again:
He claimed:
“therefore, he has no physical bodily functions”
Uhhh where does this say that:
When the dead rise, they will neither marry nor be given in marriage; they will be like the angels in heaven. (Mark 12:25)
At the resurrection people will neither marry nor be given in marriage; they will be like the angels in heaven. (Matt: 22:30)
Jesus answered, “The sons of this age marry and are given in marriage. 35But those who are considered worthy to share in the age to come and in the resurrection from the dead will neither marry nor be given in marriage. 36In fact, they can no longer die, because they are like the angels. (Luke 20:35-36)
1. When Gabriel(saw) and Michael(as) visit Lot(as):
3But Lot insisted so strongly that they followed him into his house. He prepared a feast for them and baked unleavened bread, and THEY ATE. (Genesis 19:3)
From Forerunner Commentary
Genesis 19:3
The angels ate. Can we assume they had the other bodily parts necessary for consuming a meal—stomach, intestines? It is difficult to determine how far we can carry this, but they did eat human food.
2. At the news of Issac’s(as) birth:
Meanwhile, Abraham ran to the herd, selected a tender, choice calf, and gave it to a servant, who hurried to prepare it. 8Then Abraham brought curds and milk and the calf that had been prepared, and he set them before the men and stood by them under the tree as they ate. (Genesis Genesis 18:7-8_
Now I know Ken is going to say something like:
“That was when they were manifested in human bodies!” Well besides the fact that it still defeats Ken on the “lack of bodily functions” he claimed and insulted a hadith well:
3. The Manna (aka spiritual food)
17But they continued to sin against Him, rebelling in the desert against the Most High. 18They willfully tested God by demanding the food they craved. 19They spoke against God, saying, “Can God really prepare a table in the wilderness? 20When He struck the rock, water gushed out and torrents overflowed. But can He also give bread or supply His people with meat?”21Therefore the LORD heard and was filled with wrath; so a fire was kindled against Jacob, and His anger flared against Israel 22because they did not believe God or rely on His salvation.23Yet He commanded the clouds above and opened the doors of the heavens.24He rained down MANNA for them to eat; He gave them GRAIN FROM HEAVEN. 25 MAN ATE THE BREAD OF ANGELS; He sent them food in abundance. (Psalm 78:17-26)
Pulpit Commentary
… It cannot be laid down dogmatically that angels require no food…
Barnes’ Notes on the Bible
Man did eat angels’ food – Food that came from heaven; food so directly and manifestly from heaven that it might be supposed to be the same kind that was eaten there, and that had now been sent down by a special miracle for man; food so delicate and so free from the ordinary coarse properties of food, that it might be supposed to be such as angels feed on…
Amen…
Alright QB have fun.
Stew, I hereby place you under arrest for crimes against humanity. Your nuking of Pennywise violated the Geneva conventions.
The author, C. K. Quaterman is not credible. The suppossed quotes from Volume 8 are a volume of Aprocyphal works and Psedo-Clementine literature. He appears to be just throwing out names to look impressive.
I could not find where Justin Marty nor Irenaeus says those things – to take the first two and looked up to see if they comment on Genesis 6:1-4.
Quarterman does not give any reference to volume 1 of the Ante-Nicean fathers – which Justin Martyr and Irenaeus are in that volume.
Even if some Early church fathers interpreted the sons of God in Genesis 6:1-4 as angels, their interpretations are not infallible, and Jesus’ interpretation is infallible and overrules them.
So, “sons of God” in this context is either:
1. males who follow God who were seduced by the beauty of ungodly women.
or
2. men who were possessed by demons – demon possession is real, as the gospels demonstrate.
Also, the context of judgment on the sins of humankind (Genesis 6:5-6) demonstrate it was human sin.
You’re really gonna play this game? This is why no one takes you seriously. You’re a joke. Here you go:
Justin Martyr, Second Apology, Chapter 5:
CHAPTER V — HOW THE ANGELS TRANSGRESSED.
But if this idea take possession of some one that if we acknowledge God as our helper, we should not, as we say, be oppressed and persecuted by the wicked; this, too, I will solve. God, when He had made the whole world, and subjected things earthly to man, and arranged the heavenly elements for the increase of fruits and rotation of the seasons, and appointed this divine law–for these things also He evidently made for man–committed the care of men and of all things under heaven to angels whom He appointed over them. But the angels transgressed this appointment. and were captivated by love of women, and begat children who are those that are called demons; and besides, they afterwards subdued the human race to themselves, partly by magical writings, and partly by fears and the punishments they occasioned, and partly by teaching them to offer sacrifices, and incense, and libations, of which things they stood in need after they were enslaved by lustful passions; and among men they sowed murders, wars, adulteries, intemperate deeds, and all wickedness.
http://earlychristianwritings.com/text/justinmartyr-secondapology.html
Irenaeus, Demonstration of the Apostolic Preaching:
And for a very long while wickedness extended and spread, and reached and laid hold upon the whole race of mankind, until a very small seed of righteousness remained among them and illicit unions took place upon the earth, since angels were united with the daughters of the race of mankind; and they bore to them sons who for their exceeding greatness were called giants. And the angels brought as presents to their wives teachings of wickedness, [110] in that they brought them the virtues of roots and herbs, dyeing in colors and cosmetics, the discovery of rare substances, love-potions, aversions, amours, concupiscence, constraints of love, spells of bewitchment, and all sorcery and idolatry hateful to God; by the entry of which things into the world evil extended and spread, while righteousness was diminished and enfeebled.
http://earlychristianwritings.com/text/demonstrationapostolic.html
Get over it. Your church fathers did not believe as you did.
You found a lot of quotes from the early church fathers, ok – I will grant that they seemed to believe that – as even today there are conservative Christians who also believe that, and they believe that those beings (the Nephilim) were wiped out with the flood.
I don’t accept that interpretation (that angels have corporal bodies and bodily functions – because of those verses in the gospels about angels being spirit beings that cannot get married, etc., seems to trump all those interpretations.
But it is possible that the meaning of Genesis 6:1-4 and Jude 6-8 is that they were humans who were demon possessed, and the evil spirits within the humans drove them to do evil things. Demon possession of physical humans makes all the verses harmonize.
That preserves both the gospel passages and Jesus’ words in Matthew 22, Mark 12 and Luke 20 and also Genesis 6:1-4 and Jude 6-8 – as all God’s word and God-breathed/ inspired. (which Qur’an is not)
Your assumptions mean nothing. There is nothing to indicate that they possessed humans. Stop making things up to avoid the embarrassing truth.
You can’t get it through your head that the NT interpretation is a) irrelevant and b) insignificant as it referred to heaven not EARTH. Genesis 6 refers to EARTH.
Your pathetic excuses will not fly. Your Bible is a contradictory mess of anonymously heretics and their opinions, which proves that it is not “inspired”. Get over it Pennywise.
Your 600 year late false religion that you anachronistically puts itself ignorantly back into the OT (only selected parts, because whatever does not fit is accused of being ‘Jewish / Zionist corruption, etc.” – another indication that Islam is false) means nothing. The NT is the true fulfillment of the OT. get over it, whiny Faizy. It is you who act like Pennywise – an evil clown – your sinful anger shows your violent nature.
😂🤣 Stop trying to deflect from your idiotic religion and it’s silly myths. Your pathetic man-worshiping religion came too late after the Tanakh so your revisionist interpretations mean nothing, Pennywise. To make matters worse, your pathetic revisionism is too late even when compared to the early church. It’s funny how you morons always throw your precious “church fathers” under the bus when they disagree with your opinions. 😆
Oh and yeah, the Bible is a corrupt mess. Every rational person accepts that. The only ones who don’t are idiots like you. Christianity mostly appeals to brainwashed clowns such as yourself.
stop trying to deflect to your anachronistic and 600 year late false religion that thinks demons can urinate and fart. It is your religion that is nutty.
🤣🤣🤣 Your nutty religion believes horny angels got it on with humans. The early church believed as such. So did the Jews. You are embarrassed by this and have to lie to save yourself. Your nutty religion is a hot mess!
Your anachronistic assumptions also mean nothing.
Your pathetic whiny responses mean nothing. I know you’re embarrassed Pennywise. It must suck to find out how stupid your religion is. Aww, it’s okay clown. Don’t cry.
Hey, I just thought of an even better name for this clown: Kennywise! 😂
Probably because you are the true “Pennywise” clown in your angry and violent filled heart, who could be so angry to kill people in the future, because your heart is filled with anger, hatred, murder and malice – Matthew 5:21-26
😭😭 Awww, poor Kennywise keeps whining.
Isn’t it your mangod who will kill people in the future? 😉
And wasn’t it your god who told his marauding hordes to murder children and infants? What kind of a wacko are you to believe such things? 😲
More from the church fathers. Pennywise’s woes get worse.
Tertullian, Apology, Chapter 22:
And we affirm indeed the existence of certain spiritual essences; nor is their name unfamiliar. The philosophers acknowledge there are demons; Socrates himself waiting on a demon’s will. Why not? since it is said an evil spirit attached itself specially to him even from his childhood–turning his mind no doubt from what was good. The poets are all acquainted with demons too; even the ignorant common people make frequent use of them in cursing. In fact, they call upon Satan, the demon-chief, in their execrations, as though from some instinctive soul-knowledge of him. Plato also admits the existence of angels. The dealers in magic, no less, come forward as witnesses to the existence of both kinds of spirits. We are instructed, moreover, by our sacred books how from certain angels, who fell of their own flee-will, there sprang a more wicked demon-brood, condemned of God along with the authors of their race, and that chief we have referred to. It will for the present be enough, however, that some account is given of their work. Their great business is the ruin of mankind. So, from the very first, spiritual wickedness sought our destruction.
http://earlychristianwritings.com/text/tertullian01.html
More woes for Pennywise:
Eusebius, Preparatio Evangelica, Book 5:
But in fact it is. manifest to all that he who practises the things that are dear to the wicked can never be a friend of the good. So then it was not to gods, nor yet to good daemons, but only to the wicked, that those of whom I have spoken paid worship.
And this argument is still further confirmed by Plutarch, in the passage where he says that the mythical narratives told as concerning gods are certain tales about daemons, and the deeds of Giants and Titans celebrated in song among the Greeks are also stories about daemons, intended to suggest a new phase of thought.
Of this kind then perhaps were the statements in the Sacred Scripture concerning the giants before the Mood, and those concerning their progenitors, of whom it is said, ‘And when the angels of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair, they took unto them wives of all that they chose,’ and of these were born ‘the giants the men of renown which were of old.’
For one might say that these daemons are those giants, and that their spirits have been deified by the subsequent generations of men, and that their battles, and their quarrels among themselves, and their wars are the subjects of these legends that are told as of gods. Plutarch indeed, in the discourse which he composed On Isis and the gods of the Egyptians, speaks as follows word for word.
http://www.tertullian.org/fathers/eusebius_pe_05_book5.htm
@ QB
I’m telling you got so much material here this calls for a new “Example of the Church”
PS
If I committed a crime you’re my accomple on those nuke codes.
Will do, inshaAllah!
Hey, I just gave you the codes. You pushed the button. I wash my hands like Pontius Pilate. 😁
“Even if some Early church fathers interpreted the sons of God in Genesis 6:1-4 as angels, their interpretations are not infallible, and Jesus’ interpretation is infallible and overrules them.”
Well, now that we know that Pennywise’s church fathers disagreed with his revisionist interpretation (and he still throws them under the bus), he actually doesn’t realize that he is basically saying that the church fathers, who evidently read the same Bible he does, went against the opinion of “Jesus” and believed that angels could procreate. Heretics! How dare you go against your mangod?!
Oh but wait. The mangod didn’t say anything about angels getting it on with humans ON EARTH. Pennywise just can’t get this through his monkey brain. So appealing to “Jesus” simply doesn’t work and is irrelevant.
Oh and let’s not forget good old Jude. He also contradicts Pennywise and his mangod. What else can we expect from such a nutty religion?
@ QB
Ass an addon isn’t the Holy Spirit supposed to stop misinterpretation of the Bible so either:
1. Ken doesn’t have it. So we would be right in avoiding this false teacher.
2. The Church Fathers don’t have it and we would be right in ignoring what else they wrote and conclude they are the false teachers (which also refutes Ken)
So what to do? 🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔
Aye, aye, aye…the woes keep getting worse for poor Pennywise. 😭
@ QB
“I was my hands like Pontious Pilate”
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣💀💀💀💀💀
“o, “sons of God” in this context is either:
1. males who follow God who were seduced by the beauty of ungodly women.”
no evidence given, just conjectural bulbullshit
“or
2. men who were possessed by demons – demon possession is real, as the gospels demonstrate.”
But it is a non-physical entity raping a body, how does it put its affect in a body?
in the gospels jesus the sinner has no respect for others property and tells the demons to go and rape pigs, the pigs panicked.
this means non-physical entities can put in physical affect….so yhwhs angels did the same with women
i find it funny that ken temple thinks holy spirit is just limited to specific location of christian women ,when according to ken, yhwh filled a birth canal.
i am disgusted with shameless yhwh. his pedophilic urge to fill a woman disgusts me.
I think I’ve accomplished what I wanted. Anyway, was nice chatting with all of you. The level of discourse here is …… A word of advice: If Muslims ceased proselytizing, people like me wouldn’t critique all the flaws in Islam. You can be a Muslim and a fantastic person,but Islam isn’t for everyone. Islam is as irrational as any other religion. Peace:)
i dont get it, created things by nature are powerless and by nature weak
you initially thought islam taught that satan was the god of this world
….thats the stuff in torah and new testament, not quran
Um, people can think whatever they want. We could care less. We will continue to proselytize because that is our duty. Whether people choose to accept the invitation to accept Islam or not is their business. But on the Day of Judgment, they might not have any excuse for why they rejected the invitation.
@ Anthony
1.Stew, I think you replied to the wrong post. You seem awfully pissed off. You okay?
I’m not angry simply blunt about subjects. A f*ckboy is a “Weak, contemptible man” my apologies sometimes I forget I’m talking to booshy suburban kids so please forgive me.
Now I’m sorry you don’t believe in your text Anthony and just committed blasphemy:
“I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and CREATE EVIL; I am the LORD, that doeth all these things.” (Isaiah 45:7)
Do not both good and EVIL things proceed from the mouth of the Most High? (Lamentations 3:38)
Shall the horn be blown in a city, And the people not tremble? Shall EVIL befall a city, And the LORD hath NOT DONE IT? (Amos 3:6)
Several points:
1. You assume there is absolute evil
2. This life is simply a test.
3. Common sense says both good and evil come from God but since you all don’t really believe in monotheism I guess this will have to be explained.
4. Seeking protection from temptation or people’s evil (not just Satan’s s you thought that verse said) does not mean its all powerful.
2. “An affirmation that God is a deceiver.”
Well let’s bust open your text again:
Then said I: ‘Ah, Lord GOD! surely Thou hast greatly deceived this people and Jerusalem, saying: Ye shall have peace; whereas the sword reacheth unto the soul.’ (Jeremiah 4:10)
“The LORD said to him, ‘How?’ And he said, ‘I will go out and be a deceiving spirit in the mouth of all his prophets.’ Then He said, ‘You are to entice him and also prevail. Go and do so.’ So now the LORD has put a deceiving spirit in the mouths of all these prophets of yours. The LORD has decreed disaster for you.” (Kings 22:22-23)
I will set My face against that man and make him a sign and a proverb; I will cut him off from among My people. Then you will know that I am the LORD. 9But if the prophet is enticed to speak a message, then it was I the LORD who enticed him, and I will stretch out My hand against him and destroy him from among My people Israel. (Ezekiel 14:8-9)
Man, you sure you’re Jewish Anthony lol? Yes God, deceives people who have the intent to do evil and never believe so they continue down their path and earn their punishment.
And ˹so˺ in this way I have made for every prophet an enemy for him. There were evil ones from both humans and demons. They would inspire each other with propaganda but had your Lord wanted they would not have done that, so leave them and what they make up alone.I allowed this only so that those who don’t believe in a life to come, will have their hearts incline towards that and become obsessed with it, so that they can earn these sins they’re constantly committing. (6:112-113)
3. Well, when Muslims find out what actually happened, let me know.:) . Have a good day:)
We do know what happened, he (as) was saved from your evil, cursed nation.
4. I think I’ve accomplished what I wanted. Anyway, was nice chatting with all of you. The level of discourse here is …… A word of advice: If Muslims ceased proselytizing, people like me wouldn’t critique all the flaws in Islam.
I’m sorry I’ll translate for everyone:
“My weak arguments were destroyed and I was not expecting this much heat. I have to try and save face now because being refuted using my own book requires too much humility to admit I was wrong. So now I’m going to run away until death finally takes me and I come before my Lord and have to explain why I chose to ignore the truth and turn away before being thrown into Hell with the rest of my wicked ancestors who worshipped the Golden Calf.”
Okey dokey later Anthony and become a Muslim.
Mr Heathcliff,
there is no’ Satan’ in the Torah. You have ,obviously, never read the Torah.
Paul seems like a good guy, fairly knowledgeable, but the rest…….. Paul, maybe we’ll meet one day at Speakers Corner:) . I’m out
Can’t believe I missed Stew’s meltdown….
‘We do know what happened, he (as) was saved from your evil, cursed nation.”
This will be my last post…. Your reply doesn’t convey self- assurance… Why so angry?
And this crazy rant
”So now I’m going to run away until death finally takes me and I come before my Lord and have to explain why I chose to ignore the truth and turn away before being thrown into Hell with the rest of my wicked ancestors who worshipped the Golden Calf.”
I don’t know…. Since I don’t believe in a hell, this sounds less like me and more like a fantasy of yours:)
…Anyway, I’m glad you exposed yourself as just another ignorant anti Semite… Unlike you, I don’t need to insult Muslims, many of whom are great people; definitely not cursed or going to an everlasting fire:) I might post in a few weeks to share some photos from Jerusalem, the capital of the Jewish state. . Enjoy the week.)))
Anthony, before you go, I just want to clarify your disbelief in hell. How do you explain Daniel 12 which refers to the resurrection of both the righteous and the wicked. What will happen to the wicked?
@ QB
How’s he going to be able to answer that when he has 4 diffrent Hebrew Bibles? Can’t make doctrines without an agreed on text (that you can read in its original writing) We gotta walk before we run…
Still, I’m interested in how he justifies his disbelief in hell in light of Daniel 12.
@ QB
Oh QB you mean texts like this:
Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake: some to everlasting life, others to shame and everlasting contempt (Daniel 12:2)
Or this:
“As for you, go your way till the end. You will rest, and then at the end of the days you will rise to receive your allotted inheritance.” (Daniel 12:13)
Is that what you’re talking about that Anthony says he doesn’t believe in?
Or were you talking about His scholars?
“the punishment of the wicked in Gehenna is twelve months” (Shabbat 33b)
But the disciples of Balaam, the wicked, inherit gehinnom, and descend into the nethermost pit, as it is said: “For you, O God, will bring them down to the nethermost pit those murderous and treacherous men; they shall not live out half their days; but I trust in You” (Psalms 55:24).
https://www.sefaria.org/Pirkei_Avot.5.19?lang=bi
Judah ben Tema…used to say: the arrogant is headed for Gehinnom and the blushing for the garden of Eden.
https://www.sefaria.org/Pirkei_Avot.5.20?lang=bi
the Sages said: as long as a man engages in too much conversation with women, he causes evil to himself, he neglects the study of the Torah, and in the end he will inherit gehinnom.
https://www.sefaria.org/Pirkei_Avot.1.5?lang=bi
QB God already answered this silly billy:
“And among them are the Illiterate ones who don’t know the Scripture except for wishful thinking, they’re doing nothing but making things up and assuming (2:78)
Oh and bonus round on Satan
and then sound again a tekia and a terua while they are standing in the Amida prayer? He answers: In order to confuse the Satan, for this double blowing of the shofar demonstrates Israel’s love for the mitzva, and this will confuse Satan when he brings his accusations against Israel before the heavenly court, and the Jewish people will receive a favorable judgment.
https://www.sefaria.org/Rosh_Hashanah.16b?lang=bi
I wonder how we do the equivalent for Jews. Example of the…Sages? 🤔
Anthony, you seem like a good guy, but extremely defensive.
Also, I have to say, your shameless support of Zionism and its theft of Palestinian land is disgusting. You may be a good person in general, but your support for the racist ideology of Zionism is sickening.
By the way, how can Jerusalem be the “eternal” capital when it was originally occupied by the indigenous people of Canaan? It seems to me that it is the eternal capital of those people, not the Israelites.
@ QB
Oh no doubt it was the pagan name they call the city tells you that:
The name consists of two elements: yrw and salem [el’v]. yrwmay signify “foundation” or “city, ” while salem [el’v] is the name of a deity. The name means either “the foundation of (the god) Shalem,” the patron-god of the city, or “the city of Shalem.” Thus, a certain sanctity adhered to the city long before David acquired it
https://www.biblestudytools.com/dictionary/jerusalem/
@ Anthony
Can’t be anti-Semite when your Semite genius try that lame excuse with someone else. Idk why you keep thinking I’m upset lol none of what you said changes the fact that your ungrateful nation was cursed multiple times by God and His prophets. An individual does nit reflect on a nation’s history and yours is terrible.
Moving on wow you don’t believe in Hell? I guess you know more than the Amoraim. I mean you already make up your own religion and fan fiction so why not?
Oh you mean that fictional place that you had to use Christians to establish and can’t sustain by yourself? Why don’t you post some pics of the Temple instead oh wait…
The church fathers were good in many ways, but they were not infallible. So, we are not obligated to follow an interpretation that does not seem to harmonize with all of God-breathed Scripture.
Putting the comment here so I can find it later.
Anthony,
You have some interesting comments.
Satan is not a supernatural being ?
Does Judaism teach that the Satan of Job 1-2 and Zechariah 3:1-5 is the same spirit being as the one who tempted Eve in Genesis 3:1-8, who came in the form of a snake / serpent ?
He is the accuser and the tempter toward sin.
Ezekiel chapter 28 seems to indicate he is a fallen cherub (a kind of angel) who fell away because of his pride and arrogance of his beauty and wisdom. (see especially verse 13 – “you were in Eden, the garden of God” – implies he is the one who tempted Eve. verse 14 – you were the anointed cherub, etc. verses 11-17 are key that seems to show he is the spirit behind the pride and arrogance and injustice of evil political leaders, like the king of Tyre – 28:1-5, 11; also the spirit behind the king of Babylon in Isaiah 14:4-14
The NT gives us more insight into who he is.
“Does Judaism teach that the Satan of Job 1-2 and Zechariah 3:1-5 is the same spirit being as the one who tempted Eve in Genesis 3:1-8, who came in the form of a snake / serpent ?”
Lol, even when Kennywise asks for the Jewish interpretation, he assumes that it has to be in line with the two most common Christian interpretations. Nevermind that the text simply states that it was an animal in the garden and there is no mention of Satan or him or any other spirit possessing the snake. Only some Midrashim interpretations claim that Satan was “riding” the snake but the mainstream interpretation is that the serpent was simply a physical creature:
The Serpent was a physical animal which was part of the natural world. In fact, according to the Talmud, it was much more humanlike before its sin (Sanhedrin 59b). However, it was given a mission from God – to tempt man to sin, to cause Adam and Eve to transgress the one commandment they had been given.
Before Adam and Eve sinned and ate from the Tree of Knowledge, they had no inner desire to sin. Their “evil inclination” was an external force, embodied in the Serpent. (Some Midrashic statements alternatively depict Satan as a separate entity, riding the Snake which was in its service.)
https://www.aish.com/atr/What-Was-the-Serpent.html?mobile=yes
Lol bla bla
Bulge speaking his native language. 😂
” he assumes that it has to be in line with the two most common Christian interpretations.”
what do you expect for a american pagan cockroach who believes that the murder of iraqi children was for the “greater good” ?
this murderous mind believes that yhwh BROKE his own commandment “do not murder” to appease himself, what would you expect from such scum bag?
this murderous mind, child of devil believes that even if the jews believed in jebus, they would still HAVE to nail him to appease yhwh….BREAKING commandment “do not murder”
“The NT gives us more insight into who he is.”
this is like saying windows 10 is windows 1991