Humans are defined as the servants of Allah. And those who are not his servants? Are they also humans?
Seems not to be the case.
Rights are divided under Shariah in to those belonging to Allah and those belonging to his servants. And the rest of us?
Blasphemy and apostasy laws are filtered out of the discussion.
Killing is described as a private matter which Allah does not interfere with and is left to the families to sort out between themselves. This is misleading because it doesn’t deal with the situation of those who are living outside the rule of Shariah and have chosen to reject it as a governing ordinance for their society. Are they fully protected and guaranteed to be safe from all harm even if they have rejected Shariah?
In the bible killing is the destruction of the image of God in man which is a serious offence to God.
Amputation contradicts the law of Moses which never mandates cutting off limbs as reparation for a material loss.
A little video like this presents a rosy picture of Shariah but are we being told the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth about Shariah?
To begin all humans are God’s property it’s just a matter of are they going to submit to this in this life or the Next:
4:132. Yes, God owns all things whether in the heavens or the earth, and He is enough for those who trust in Him to take care of their affairs.
4:133. If He wished, He could take you away and replace you with others, and He’s certainly capable of doing that.
4:134. So if any pursue the worldly life, the rewards of it and the Next are God’s to give. And He constantly Hears and Sees everything…
If God wishes to punish he can do so however he likes. Even the concept of punishment and blasphemy exist in the Bible:
You have an entire chapter dedicated to Apostasy:
6 “If your brother, the son of your mother, your son or your daughter, the wife [c]of your bosom, or your friend who is as your own soul, secretly entices you, saying, ‘Let us go and serve other gods,’ which you have not known, neither you nor your fathers, 7 of the gods of the people which are all around you, near to you or far off from you, from one end of the earth to the other end of the earth, 8 you shall not [d]consent to him or listen to him, nor shall your eye pity him, nor shall you spare him or conceal him; 9 but you shall surely kill him; your hand shall be first against him to put him to death, and afterward the hand of all the people. 10 And you shall stone him with stones until he dies, because he sought to entice you away from the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, from the house of bondage. 11 So all Israel shall hear and fear, and not again do such wickedness as this among you. (Deuteronomy 13: 6-11)
Also, you can add the Golden Calf incident where they killed all the people who worshipped it.
Now let’s look at blasphemy:
10 Now an Israelite woman’s son, whose father was an Egyptian, went out among the people of Israel. And the Israelite woman’s son and a man of Israel fought in the camp, 11 and the Israelite woman’s son blasphemed the Name, and cursed. Then they brought him to Moses. His mother’s name was Shelomith, the daughter of Dibri, of the tribe of Dan. 12 And they put him in custody, till the will of the Lord should be clear to them.
13 Then the Lord spoke to Moses, saying, 14 “Bring out of the camp the one who cursed, and let all who heard him lay their hands on his head, and let all the congregation stone him. 15 And speak to the people of Israel, saying, Whoever curses his God shall bear his sin. 16 Whoever blasphemes the name of the Lord shall surely be put to death. All the congregation shall stone him. The sojourner as well as the native, when he blasphemes the Name, shall be put to death.
Furthermore not all of Gods laws are universal so the argument regarding Moses’s(as) laws and amputation is irrelevant. God’s laws can change at diffrent times or people for example at one point it was permissable for brother and sister to marry. We wouldn’t say Moses(as) is false because God abrogated this law.
Or if you want to simplify this:
60:8. God has not forbidden you from being kind and acting justly towards those who did not go to war with you over religion, nor kicked you out of your homes because loves those who implement justice.
60:9. God has only forbidden you in regards to those who fought against you on account of your faith, and have driven you out of your homes or helped and supported in your banishment. Whoever makes friends with them, are the ones doing wrong.
Finnally Shariah is divided into civil and religious matters. Non Muslims are not bound by religious matters in Shariah for example, they can sell alcohol to each other, practice their false religions etc. Civil matters would apply to everybody regardless of religion for example traffic laws or anything of that nature which is norml as there’s no society in the world where you can rebel against the state’s laws.
And don’t forget that they should pay a tax on their unbelief. Of course if they were to refuse such an extortion it doesn’t end well. A religion masquerading as a protection racket.
So first we had madman, and now have this Isaac clown making idiotic statements based on his ignorance. Any other geniuses with moronic opinions about Sharia?
“Humans are defined as the servants of Allah. And those who are not his servants? Are they also humans?
Seems not to be the case.”
Madman has to move from post to post after he gets embarrassed on a previous post.
Everyone is a servant of Allah (swt), believer and unbeliever. Your idiotic logic is the main reason why you are a laughingstock and no one takes you seriously.
“Amputation contradicts the law of Moses which never mandates cutting off limbs as reparation for a material loss.”
LOL, is this for real? Have you ever read the Bible madman, you lying loser?
“If two men are fighting and the wife of one of them comes to rescue her husband from his assailant, and she reaches out and seizes him by his private parts, you shall cut off her hand. Show her no pity.”
Ooops, now what was that about amputation “contradicting the law of Moses”?
Seriously madman, why haven’t committed yourself to an asylum yet? You don’t belong in the real world with the rest of us.
“If two men are fighting and the wife of one of them comes to rescue her husband from his assailant, and she reaches out and seizes him by his private parts, you shall cut off her hand. Show her no pity.”
Faiz: “Ooops, now what was that about amputation “contradicting the law of Moses”? ”
I said material loss, not damage to a human being which is not in the same category. Anything that doesn’t damage the human body itself cannot be compensated for by damaging the human body.
So theft cannot be compensated for by amputation under the law of Moses. This shows that Islam is simply wrong.
Quote “Furthermore not all of Gods laws are universal so the argument regarding Moses’s(as) laws and amputation is irrelevant. God’s laws can change at diffrent times or people for example at one point it was permissable for brother and sister to marry. We wouldn’t say Moses(as) is false because God abrogated this law” End quote
I agree certain laws can be abrogated but in the bible God tells us which. It is not left to us to make the decision.
Laws can only change when the a new covenant is made and this is always with accompanying signs and manifestations of God in the bible.
This simply did not happen as far as Islam was concerned so we know that it cannot be from God.
For example if Allah is the God of Moses who revealed himself and spoke at Sinai why did he remain hidden and silent at the time of Mohammed?
When the new covenant was brought in the church was created with many signs and wonders also.
Quote : Moving on yes even non Muslims have rights and you read an example in this thread: https://bloggingtheology2.com/2018/12/30/an-islamophobe-sends-an-email/comment-page-1/#comment-1090
Or if you want to simplify this:
60:8. God has not forbidden you from being kind and acting justly towards those who did not go to war with you over religion, nor kicked you out of your homes because loves those who implement justice.” End quote
Non muslims do not have the right to openly proselytize and carry out their religion without let or hindrance under the rule of Sharia. This is an obvious truth.
The punishment of blasphemy and apostasy laws are annuled by the teaching of Jesus. By the creation of the new covenant promised in the OT and fulfilled in the NT, which will remain to the end of the world, Islam would be excluded from having any right to call itself a legal entity with juridical rights before God.
Doing moral or ethical good to a human being is never optional in the bible. A change of the law with no authorization.
The christian is commanded to show love to the peaceful enemy as well as family and friends. This is the teaching of Jesus.
He can’t, of course. Plus, madman basically just decides on a whim which laws are still in effect and which ones are not. He believes that homosexuals should be executed, but not witches. I wonder if he feels that women who touch a man’s private parts while defending their husbands should have their hand chopped off?
“I said material loss, not damage to a human being which is not in the same category. Anything that doesn’t damage the human body itself cannot be compensated for by damaging the human body.”
LOL!! What difference does that make? Your Bible still requires AMPUTATION for a rather mundane crime.
Moreover, Deuteronomy 25 does not say anything about any “damage” to the man’s private parts. Nice try but your heretical attempts to add to the text something that is it not there will not fool anyone.
“If two men are fighting and the wife of one of them comes to rescue her husband from his assailant, and she reaches out and seizes him by his private parts, 12 you shall cut off her hand. Show her no pity.”
See? Nothing there about any “damage”. Stop lying for once, demon.
“So theft cannot be compensated for by amputation under the law of Moses. This shows that Islam is simply wrong.”
No, it just shows that you were embarrassed, which is why you ran off for a few days to lick your wounds. Face it, madman. You are a buffoon.
The Sharia requires amputation for material losses in certain situations. The Mosaic Law, assuming it is legitimate (one can never know for sure when it comes to what the Bible says), requires amputation simply for grabbing a man’s genitals during a fight. This shows how much of a hypocritical idiot you really are.
“I agree certain laws can be abrogated but in the bible God tells us which. It is not left to us to make the decision.”
Actually, you decide on a whim which laws you want to follow. That is the hallmark of a hypocrite. As I have said before, the book of Ezekiel prophecies that the temple will be rebuilt after the battle of Gog and Magog and the temple rites will be reinstated, including the law banning uncircumcised Gentiles from the temple grounds. But you, realizing the uncomfortable position it puts your pagan religion in by proving it false, have to interpret it in nonsensical ways.
“Laws can only change when the a new covenant is made and this is always with accompanying signs and manifestations of God in the bible.
This simply did not happen as far as Islam was concerned so we know that it cannot be from God.”
Actually, it did. There were many signs that Islam is from God. We have miracles. We have prophecies. All of this points to the truth of Islam and the falsehood of pagan Christianity.
“For example if Allah is the God of Moses who revealed himself and spoke at Sinai why did he remain hidden and silent at the time of Mohammed?”
LOL!! He remained hidden to all the prophets, stupid! Even Jesus (pbuh)! Moses (pbuh) was given the special privilege, because that was God’s will.
Also, Muhammad (pbuh) was given the honor of actually speaking with God in the heavens. No one else was given that honor.
“When the new covenant was brought in the church was created with many signs and wonders also.”
Blah, blah, blah. No evidence, of course. The church was an apocalyptic group of desperate people who were convinced the end was coming. It didn’t. Ergo, your phony church was false.
“Non muslims do not have the right to openly proselytize and carry out their religion without let or hindrance under the rule of Sharia. This is an obvious truth.”
LOL, so what? Why would Islamic law allow a pagan to proselytize the worship of false gods? Non-Muslims can practice their religion freely but they cannot try to spread it to Muslims. Islam has self-respect and dignity.
“The punishment of blasphemy and apostasy laws are annuled by the teaching of Jesus. By the creation of the new covenant promised in the OT and fulfilled in the NT, which will remain to the end of the world, Islam would be excluded from having any right to call itself a legal entity with juridical rights before God.”
HAHAHAHA, the pathetic German pagan is trying to project his xenophobic and Euro-centric theology on to the Bible! Why aren’t Christians like Kenny the bootlicker condemning this?
Of course, the book of Revelation says that at the end of time, no religion will have any rights. Either you convert to Christianity or you die. I am not sure how madman can argue for the superiority of Christianity in this regard.
There is no evidence that blasphemy and apostasy laws were “annulled”. Madman can’t produce any evidence from the Bible.
Doing moral or ethical good to a human being is never optional in the bible. A change of the law with no authorization.
The christian is commanded to show love to the peaceful enemy as well as family and friends. This is the teaching of Jesus.”
LOL, so how exactly do you “show love” to a homosexual, since you believe he must be executed? Madman, for the love of God, please commit yourself already!
– The disabled, the blind and the elderly, even if they’re rich
– The poor and the insane
– slaves
– A chronically ill-man even if he is rich
– Religious people who keep themselves free for praying and worshipping, i.e. churches, cloisters and oratories
– If a non-Muslim voluntarily participates for military service.
– If the Islamic state becomes unable to protect non-Muslims, then they are legally exonerated from paying the tax. (Ibnul Qayyim, Ahkam Ahlul Dhimma, Volume1, pp.8, 15)
@ Issac
Yeah, a “real” racket has started here. Also, all non-Muslims are eligible for social security when they retire.
You stated:
“I agree certain laws can be abrogated but in the bible God tells us which. It is not left to us to make the decision.”
I agree to hold onto that thought. Was the Bible written by God? Is it even in the first person? Obviously no it’s someone writing randomly and inserting there own foot notes like Moses was the shyest man on Earth, etc. So you have nothing directly from God just second hand information from people not there.
Next, please show where the Jews came with miracles outside of Moses(as). If you’re using the argument of “his followers performed miracles” so did Muhammad’s(saw) so that makes no sense.
As for your last part, God almost never speaks directly to even prophets (that’s why Moses(as) is considered major) He almost always talks with an intermediary that’s why angels are Messengers.
Next Jesus(as) did not abrogate any of the Torah’s laws according to you and approved of them. Even if you argue that these we’re abrogated God at one point still approved of them so you can’t say they’re morally wrong. Moving on as long as they’re religion is harmful such as killing virgins in the volcano they’re free to practice as they like even govern themselves to their own laws. Now we’re still not going to let them preach they’re evil idolatry to Muslims but among each other do whatever you want.
Finally, you believe that at the end of time Jesus(as) will subdue all the nations under his rule. Whenever Chritians are confronted This writer said it best: “Jesus Loves His Enemies…and Then Kills Them All”
ust as Muhammad’s biography can be divided into a Meccan and Medinan period, so too can Jesus’s lifestory be divided into a First and Second Coming. (Likewise can Moses’ lifestory be divided into pre- and post-Exodus: prior to Exodus, Moses was largely peaceful, but after Exodus, Moses became the leader of the emerging Jewish state–and subsequently engaged in holy wars and even genocide against other nations.) In the First Coming of Christ, only a small segment of society (mostly from the weak and poor) accepted Jesus, whereas the leaders and authorities persecuted him. During this time period, Jesus advised his followers to engage in nonviolent resistance only, perhaps even pacifism. Jesus advised his followers to “love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you.” According to the Bible, this didn’t stop his Jewish and Roman persecutors from crucifying him.
Yet, the Second Coming of Christ is a central theological belief of Christianity. When Jesus returns to earth, the gloves will be off: no longer will he practice nonviolence or pacifism. Enemies will be mercilessly killed, not loved. In this manner, Jesus will fulfill the messianic prophecies found in the Bible–both in the Old and New Testaments.
Theft alone cannot justify cutting of limbs as it does in Islam. This contradicts the will of God as given through Moses therefore Islam must be a false religion.
Taking hold of a mans scrotum is an attack on the body which is part of the image of God. It is not, as you call it, a mundane act. It violates the sanctity of the image of God in the human body, his creation. The potential damage is very great, whether or not the the real damage is extensive or not.
God manifested his glory and spoke openly and publicly at the giving of covenants and laws in the bible. In the so called revelation of the Koran he cannot do either of these things.
Briefly on apostasy and blasphemy:
Under the old covenant the external force of law and punishment was keeping the Israelites from disobedience and all were under the law by their ethnic relation to Jacob even if they had no personal relationship to God. Israel was a mixture of regenerate and unregenerate.
In the new covenant this external force of law is replaced by the inward working of the spirit of God working through the truth. The gospel filters out those who are chosen, leaving the others free to reject God, and these are indwelt by the spirit of God.
Keeping apostasy and blasphemy laws denies the power of God and the will of God.
‘In the new covenant this external force of law is replaced by the inward working of the spirit of God working through the truth.’ Please show me where Jesus says this.
“Theft alone cannot justify cutting of limbs as it does in Islam. This contradicts the will of God as given through Moses therefore Islam must be a false religion.”
LOL, you’re “logic” is ludicrous beyond contempt. Your god would have a woman’s hand cut-off simply for grabbing a man’s genitals. And yet you are complaining about Islam? It makes far more sense to punish a thief for stealing someone’s hard-earned money than to cut-off a woman’s hand for defending her husband. This again just goes to show just how idiotic you Christians are.
“Taking hold of a mans scrotum is an attack on the body which is part of the image of God. It is not, as you call it, a mundane act. It violates the sanctity of the image of God in the human body, his creation. The potential damage is very great, whether or not the the real damage is extensive or not.”
HAHAHAHA, there it is again! Christian logic strikes again! So you think a valid punishment for grabbing a man’s genitals, which you interpret as “an attack on the body which is part of the image of God”, is to…wait for it…cut off the offending hand…which is ironically also “part of the image of God”? WOW!!
Is this the best you can do, you pathetic hypocrite?
“God manifested his glory and spoke openly and publicly at the giving of covenants and laws in the bible. In the so called revelation of the Koran he cannot do either of these things.”
Eh, wrong! When did God speak “openly” when he spoke to Abraham? Who else heard God speak? Who else heard God in the burning bush other than Moses?
“Under the old covenant the external force of law and punishment was keeping the Israelites from disobedience and all were under the law by their ethnic relation to Jacob even if they had no personal relationship to God. Israel was a mixture of regenerate and unregenerate.
In the new covenant this external force of law is replaced by the inward working of the spirit of God working through the truth. The gospel filters out those who are chosen, leaving the others free to reject God, and these are indwelt by the spirit of God.”
Blah, blah, blah. We already know the nonsensical and contradictory Christian BS on this subject. I want you to explain why you choose which laws to follow on a whim. If the “external force of law” has been “replaced”, then on what grounds do you decide that homosexuals should still be executed?
“Keeping apostasy and blasphemy laws denies the power of God and the will of God.”
No, annulling the laws denies the power of God and the will of God. It also exposes the hypocrisy of Christians, who pick and choose which laws to enforce based purely on a whim.
Commit yourself to an insane asylum. I am sure you will feel right at home.
” It makes far more sense to punish a thief for stealing someone’s hard-earned money than to cut-off a woman’s hand for defending her husband.”
It makes no sense to punish the thief by taking away his ability to work and pay off his debt. To mutilate him permanently because of money. This shows how materialistic Islam is. The biblical way is better than the islamic.
“Your god would have a woman’s hand cut-off simply for grabbing a man’s genitals.”
Your attempts to trivialize are only embarrassing you and your religion. Such an attack could at the worst destroy the mans ability to procreate or cause some other lasting damage.
“Eh, wrong! When did God speak “openly” when he spoke to Abraham? Who else heard God speak? Who else heard God in the burning bush other than Moses?”
You admit that “Allah” never spoke to Mohammed while he was on the earth or manifested his glory to him. Also he never did any miracles. At the same time you demand that we believe he was a prophet and we should submit to him? Maybe you should see a psychiatrist?
Also why did the law come in dribs and drabs to your “prophet”, when it was convenient for him?
” I want you to explain why you choose which laws to follow on a whim. If the “external force of law” has been “replaced”, then on what grounds do you decide that homosexuals should still be executed?”
Islam has also added and taken laws away from the law of Moses. By what authority considering that we just have writings based on hearsay that someone was in a cave with the angel Gabriel? Why should any sane person submit to Sharia on that basis?
The ethical and moral law does not change or the punishments for deviation therefrom.
James, Jesus and Paul are one on this.
Blasphemy: ” 10 And whosoever shall speak a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but unto him that blasphemeth against the Holy Ghost it shall not be forgiven. “But now ye also put off all these; anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth.”
Apostasy: I repeat the gospel by its very nature and as taught in the NT implies the right to accept or reject God’s offer of salvation through Jesus Christ and proclaims the power of God to finish salvation through the spirit of God not through force of law.
If Jesus was an islamic prophet why did he let his followers apostasize without threatening them?:
John 6 v 66 From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him. 67 Then said Jesus unto the twelve, Will ye also go away?
1. Can’t help but notice you glossed over Jesus’s(as) wars in his second coming despite the peace talk in the first. Or what was the Jews evidence for Jesus(as) other than ambiguous meaning stories and what they can argue is magic?
2. So if a woman’s defending her husband from an assault it makes sense to mutilate her for the possibility of what MIGHT happen as opposed to what did lol? This is a deterring punishment and rarely has to be carried out. Also, this law has multiple conditions and is suspended if:
A. Lack of 2 witnesses who saw the event directly.
B. The object doesn’t exceed a certain value
C. The object taken was not locked away
D. There is famine or the person was poor and was stealing to survive
E. The people are related
I can’t hep but notice that the only people who have a problem with this law are thieves themselves.
3. You never answered who saw God speak to Abraham(as) or defined “God manifested Himself”. But to answer your question yes Muhammads(saw) disciples did see abnormal things during his revelations:
A. Let’s see what ibn Kathir(rh) says about these Qur”an verses:
“…recite the Qur’an calmly and rhythmically with your mind contemplating on its meaning, because I am about to send a heavy Word down on you.” (73:4-5)
“This is similar to what Zayd bin Thabit said. He said, “The Messenger of Allah received some revelation while his thigh was on top of my thigh, and my thigh was almost crushed due to it.”
`A’ishah added, “Verily, I saw him receiving revelation and I noticed the sweat dropping from his forehead on a very cold day as the revelation ended.” This is the wording recorded by Al-Bukhari. Imam Ahmad recorded from `A’ishah that she said, “If the Messenger of Allah received any revelation while he was on his riding animal, it would begin moving its Jiran intensely.” The Jiran is the bottom of the neck. Ibn Jarir chose the interpretation that it (the revelation) is heavy in both ways simultaneously. This is as `Abdur-Rahman bin Zayd bin Aslam said, “Just as it is heavy in this world, it will also be heavy on the Day of Judgement in the Scales.”
B. The Qur’an and Muhammad(saw) don’t even speak the same. If you look at the Prophet’s(saw) speech patterns they are completely different from the Qur’an’s in sentence structure, word choice and emphasis (he(saw) has a tendency when he emphasizes something to mention it three times to the person for example)
C. The Arabs were master poets and they knew something was weird. For you to understand this what I’m going to do is play a major poet by the name of Imru ul Qais. What I want you to do listen for about 15 seconds to the SOUND difference between top of the line Arabic poetry and the Qur’an.
Big difference right? As opposed to previous prophets because Muhammad(saw) had to last to the Day of Judgment the Qur’an is a miracle that is also based of sound not just sight.
“It makes no sense to punish the thief by taking away his ability to work and pay off his debt. To mutilate him permanently because of money. This shows how materialistic Islam is. The biblical way is better than the islamic.”
Your ignorance is showing. Stew already explained what provisions the law provides.
The “Biblical” way is better??? LOL!! Yeah sure, let’s cut off a woman’s hand and let her take care of her children with the one good hand! After all, it was her fault for daring to defend her husband!
“Your attempts to trivialize are only embarrassing you and your religion. Such an attack could at the worst destroy the mans ability to procreate or cause some other lasting damage.”
HAHAHAHA! What a total moron! So, because there “could” be some damage, that automatically warrants chopping her hand off? What if there was no damage, you deranged monkey?
“You admit that “Allah” never spoke to Mohammed while he was on the earth or manifested his glory to him. Also he never did any miracles. At the same time you demand that we believe he was a prophet and we should submit to him? Maybe you should see a psychiatrist?”
Lying again, stupid? He did many miracles. One of them was splitting the moon which is mentioned in the Quran. That was a direct challenge to the unbelievers, who still stubbornly rejected him and dismissed the miracles as “magic”.
“Also why did the law come in dribs and drabs to your “prophet”, when it was convenient for him?”
Why not? When a situation arose, the revelation would come to explain the right course of action. If anything, it proves Muhammad’s sincerity. If he was faking the revelation, he could have tried to give a “one lump sum” revelation, like Joseph Smith.
“Islam has also added and taken laws away from the law of Moses. By what authority considering that we just have writings based on hearsay that someone was in a cave with the angel Gabriel? Why should any sane person submit to Sharia on that basis?”
Answer the question, dummy. Oh what basis do you decide on a whim which laws to follow and which to reject?
We have already refuted and embarrassed you on the proof given for Muhammad’s prophethood. You and your holy spirit are left tongue-tied.
“The ethical and moral law does not change or the punishments for deviation therefrom.”
Blah, blah, blah. Still not answering the question, eh? Why are homosexuals still supposed to be killed, but not witches or apostates?
“Blasphemy: ” 10 And whosoever shall speak a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but unto him that blasphemeth against the Holy Ghost it shall not be forgiven. “But now ye also put off all these; anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth.””
Meaning what? Does the one who blasphemes the holy spirit (which clearly is as confused as you are; oops, did I commit blasphemy??) get put to death?
“Apostasy: I repeat the gospel by its very nature and as taught in the NT implies the right to accept or reject God’s offer of salvation through Jesus Christ and proclaims the power of God to finish salvation through the spirit of God not through force of law.”
LOL, so you have no proof from the “gospel” for your beliefs regarding apostasy? Nice work, hypocrite! You just proved how you pick and choose what you want to believe.
“If Jesus was an islamic prophet why did he let his followers apostasize without threatening them?:
John 6 v 66 From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him. 67 Then said Jesus unto the twelve, Will ye also go away?”
Um because it would have been an empty threat, dummy. Jesus was living under the Roman Empire. He had no power to enforce any law.
But then your mangod did allegedly threaten the churches in Revelation for their blasphemy, didn’t he? He threatened them with the sword…and then failed to follow-up on the threat, which proves that your ludicrous religion is full of hot air.
“The “Biblical” way is better??? LOL!! Yeah sure, let’s cut off a woman’s hand and let her take care of her children with the one good hand! After all, it was her fault for daring to defend her husband!”
This is just a red herring to cite a situation where different laws are weighed against each other. In this case if one law overrides another it does not invalidate the law that is overridden. There are also situations where the law is applied alone.
“What if there was no damage, you deranged monkey?”
It is an attack on the image of God which includes the right and ability of every man to procreate which is punished by a law that is also a deterrent in the wisdom of Jehovah.
“One of them was splitting the moon which is mentioned in the Quran. That was a direct challenge to the unbelievers, who still stubbornly rejected him and dismissed the miracles as “magic”.”
LOL, of no use to mankind along with all the time consuming rituals, and the others, what were they?
“11And the Israelitish woman’s son blasphemed the name of the LORD, and cursed. And they brought him unto Moses: (and his mother’s name was Shelomith, the daughter of Dibri, of the tribe of Dan:) 12And they put him in ward, that the mind of the LORD might be shewed them.
13And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, 14Bring forth him that hath cursed without the camp; and let all that heard him lay their hands upon his head, and let all the congregation stone him.”
If Islam can recreate this framework to operate the law of blasphemy it is authorized to do so but it cannot because it never had anything to do with it in the first place.
“He threatened them with the sword”?
Twisting scripture as usual.
The immediate context of the rebuilding of the temple in Ezekiel is obviously the rebuilding which followed after the exile. Prophets firstly address the situation in which God’s people find themselves, not some far off future scenario.
“This is just a red herring to cite a situation where different laws are weighed against each other. In this case if one law overrides another it does not invalidate the law that is overridden. There are also situations where the law is applied alone.”
How is a red herring, stupid? Your Bible says to cut off the woman’s hand. How would she be expected to care for the children with one hand? Your silly “logic” has come back to bite you and you are now left tongue-tied.
“It is an attack on the image of God which includes the right and ability of every man to procreate which is punished by a law that is also a deterrent in the wisdom of Jehovah.”
LOL!! So your god has a penis then?
Isn’t the woman’s hand also made in the image of God?
Your god’s “wisdom” was clearly very short-sighted. And you still haven’t answered the question. What if there was no damage, you deranged monkey? Would her hand be cut off?
“LOL, of no use to mankind along with all the time consuming rituals, and the others, what were they?”
LOL, so now that you have been refute again, you move the goalpost, eh? Such a good little Christian monkey! So now miracles have to be of some use? So I guess Moses’ snake miracle was of use, huh? LOL, is there even an ounce of login and reason in your diseased mind?
You want more miracles? Certainly, my dear!
Jabir reported: My father had died in debt. So I came to the Prophet and said, “My father (died) leaving unpaid debts, and I have nothing except the yield of his date palms; and their yield for many years will not cover his debts. So please come with me, so that the creditors may not misbehave with me.” The Prophet went round one of the heaps of dates and invoked (Allah), and then did the same with another heap and sat on it and said, “Measure (for them).” He paid them their rights and what remained was as much as had been paid to them.
`Abdullah reported: We used to consider miracles as Allah’s Blessings, but you people consider them to be a warning. Once we were with Allah’s Messenger on a journey, and we ran short of water. He said, “Bring the water remaining with you.” The people brought a utensil containing a little water. He placed his hand in it and said, “Come to the blessed water, and the Blessing is from Allah.” I saw the water flowing from among the fingers of Allah’s Messenger, and no doubt, we heard the meal glorifying Allah, when it was being eaten (by him). (Reported by al-Bukhari)
So there you go. Miracles that were of use and benefited the people. Madman gets crushed again!
“If Islam can recreate this framework to operate the law of blasphemy it is authorized to do so but it cannot because it never had anything to do with it in the first place.”
Still not answering the question? Your idiotic ramblings aside, I am still waiting for you to answer my questions. On what basis do you decide on a whim what laws to follow and what laws to ignore?
“Twisting scripture as usual.”
Not at all, silly billy. Just because you say so doesn’t make it so. How did I “twist” your pathetic “scripture”? Didn’t your mangod threaten the churches for their blasphemous practices?
Speaking of “twisting scripture”, we have this little nugget from madman:
“The immediate context of the rebuilding of the temple in Ezekiel is obviously the rebuilding which followed after the exile. Prophets firstly address the situation in which God’s people find themselves, not some far off future scenario.”
Except that it explicitly puts it in an apocalyptic context. The battle of Gog and Magog was the context. When did this battle occur after the exile was over? Your so-called “prophets” were short-sighted and made false prophecies which disprove your scripture as a man-made book which no reasonable person will follow. I guess that explains why you follow it. LOL!!!
“Isn’t the woman’s hand also made in the image of God?”
She would be a fool for breaking it and allowing herself to become a deterrent to others.
“What if there was no damage, you deranged monkey?
If the law is a deterrent it prevents future damage by deterring this form of attack.
“So there you go. Miracles that were of use and benefited the people. Madman gets crushed again!”
Water flowing from between his fingers. Lol, What was the guy smoking that dreamt that up?
Those who commit blasphemy themselves by their pagan practices are elevating themselves to adjudicate over and punish others for blasphemy, what irony and impertinence!
The blasphemy law was in the context of the Israelite theocracy with the real Shekinah presence of God where God himself delivered the final verdict through some means of communication which is one reason why Islam cannot administer this law, even if it had the right to, which it doesn’t.
“Except that it explicitly puts it in an apocalyptic context. The battle of Gog and Magog was the context. When did this battle occur after the exile was over?”
It must have happened that Meschech and Tubal were one of the many invading powers that invaded Israel before Jerusalem was finally destroyed by the babylonian empire. So Gog and Magog are rooted in biblical history.
Madman is here for his weekly dose of embarrassment.
“She would be a fool for breaking it and allowing herself to become a deterrent to others.”
So still not answering the question. I think you realize you are stuck in a conundrum. Your book is contradictory. Apparently your god put more value on a man’s genitals than a woman’s hand, so much so that he was willing to contradict himself on the whole creating man in his image business. WOW!!
“If the law is a deterrent it prevents future damage by deterring this form of attack.”
The law can’t prevent a crime of passion, stupid. In a momentary lapse of judgement, such as a situation where her husband is being attacked, a woman could react in such a way without even thinking. Your god would have her punished for simply defending her husband. That’s not a deterrent. That’s unjust.
Now, the law of cutting the hand of a thief is a true deterrent. However, the wisdom of the law allows for extenuating circumstances, as stew already explained. No such wisdom is found in the Biblical law. I have a hard time believing this was an actual law given by God.
“Water flowing from between his fingers. Lol, What was the guy smoking that dreamt that up?”
LOL, I think I see madman’s strategy. Every time you get humiliated, you move the goalpost. Hmm, let’s see the “logical” miracles found in the Bible: raising the dead (yep, that happens everyday), multiplying fish for people to eat (oh look, someone must have been on drugs to come up with that one!), parting the sea, turning a rod into a snake (well, at least it wasn’t a talking snake like in Genesis!). I guess they were all smoking something, eh madman? Seriously, when will you commit yourself to an asylum?
“Those who commit blasphemy themselves by their pagan practices are elevating themselves to adjudicate over and punish others for blasphemy, what irony and impertinence!”
Bwwahahahha! A trinitarian pagan manworshiper is complaining about “blasphemy” from others. What irony and impertinence!
“The blasphemy law was in the context of the Israelite theocracy with the real Shekinah presence of God where God himself delivered the final verdict through some means of communication which is one reason why Islam cannot administer this law, even if it had the right to, which it doesn’t.”
Still no proof from the scriptures! Madman just keeps babbling on with his personal opinions, but cannot bring a single verse from his so-called “scripture” to prove his point.
And moron, once again, Ezekiel refutes you. The presence of God is supposed to return to the temple:
“he glory of the Lord entered the temple through the gate facing east. 5 Then the Spirit lifted me up and brought me into the inner court, and the glory of the Lord filled the temple.” (Ezekiel 43:4-5)
Man, Ezekiel is a thorn in the side of Christianity! LOL!!
“It must have happened that Meschech and Tubal were one of the many invading powers that invaded Israel before Jerusalem was finally destroyed by the babylonian empire. So Gog and Magog are rooted in biblical history.”
Oy vei! The lies just never stop coming out of madman’s mouth! There was no battle that ended in the defeat of the invading powers, you fool! And you know it, yet you still insist on these pathetic lies to save your religion. That is the true nature of a kafir, one who hides the truth even though he knows it!
So tell me madman. At what point in “Biblical history” (talk about an oxymoron) were Gog and Magog defeated as described in Ezekiel? When did the following happen:
“When Gog attacks the land of Israel, my hot anger will be aroused, declares the Sovereign Lord. 19 In my zeal and fiery wrath I declare that at that time there shall be a great earthquake in the land of Israel. 20 The fish in the sea, the birds in the sky, the beasts of the field, every creature that moves along the ground, and all the people on the face of the earth will tremble at my presence. The mountains will be overturned, the cliffs will crumble and every wall will fall to the ground. 21 I will summon a sword against Gog on all my mountains, declares the Sovereign Lord. Every man’s sword will be against his brother. 22 I will execute judgment on him with plague and bloodshed; I will pour down torrents of rain, hailstones and burning sulfur on him and on his troops and on the many nations with him.”
This talks of earthquakes, mountains being overturned, plagues and torrents of rain and hailstone. Sounds apocalyptic, doesn’t it?
This disproves Christianity. Either it was supposed to happen thousands of years ago, in which case it would be a false prophecy (and thus both Judaism and Christianity are false religions) OR it is supposed to happen in the future, in which case Christianity is a false religion, but not necessarily Judaism. So Christians are screwed either way. Your religion falls apart because of a few chapters in an apocalyptic book. Hallelujah!
“Still no proof from the scriptures! Madman just keeps babbling on with his personal opinions, but cannot bring a single verse from his so-called “scripture” to prove his point.”
Here’s the proof:
“11And the Israelitish woman’s son blasphemed the name of the LORD, and cursed. And they brought him unto Moses: (and his mother’s name was Shelomith, the daughter of Dibri, of the tribe of Dan:) 12And they put him in ward, that the mind of the LORD might be shewed them.
13And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, 14Bring forth him that hath cursed without the camp; and let all that heard him lay their hands upon his head, and let all the congregation stone him.”
Until Allah can speak Muslims have no right to administer their so-called “blasphemy” laws.
HAHAHAHA, I asked for proof of your idiotic assertion that blasphemy is no longer a punishable crime. This only further tightens the screws on Christianity. Ezekiel claims that God’s presence will enter the temple. This has yet to happen. Ergo, Christianity is a false religion since the law is supposed to be re-established.
And by the way idiot, God spoke to Moses (pbuh), but He spoke to other prophets as well either through visions or a messenger. Also, God spoke directly to Muhammad (pbuh) as well. So you’re silly claim is refuted once again.
I noticed you are increasing your weekly dose of embarrassment. Bravo!
Gog was a prince of Meschech and Tubal at the same time as the babylonians were in the ascendency and God used Babylon to punish these and other nations at the time.
This does not rule out Ezekiel using these judgements to describe judgments that will happen in the future similarily to Jesus in Matthew 25.
LOL, oh so now it represents a “future” event? Before, you were claiming it was referring to “Biblical history” (again, an oxymoron). Make up your mind, madman.
If it is referring to the future, it disproves Christianity and your false apostle Paul since Ezekiel claims that the temple will be rebuilt and the Mosaic law re-instituted. What have we been talking about all this time, dummy?
More likely it is a literal representation of the future Jerusalem which does not require a pictorial fulfilment. A pictorial fulfilment would not need the minute details that are given in the book. Give it up. Your religion is finished.
“such as a situation where her husband is being attacked, a woman could react in such a way without even thinking. Your god would have her punished for simply defending her husband. That’s not a deterrent. That’s unjust.”
And if the situation is the other way round, what then? Both the husband and her man are the attackers?
Oy vei! That’s your Bible’s problem because it doesn’t explain if the situation was reversed. That is further proof that it is a man-made document. Man’s laws are vague and need to be constantly updated. God’s laws are eternally wise. This leads me to believe that the law in Deuteronomy 25 was not one of God’s actual laws, or it was more specific but has been edited over time.
Read carefully what your Bible says, silly madman. It is describing a situation where the husband is being assaulted:
“If two men are fighting and the wife of one of them comes to rescue her husband from his assailant”
See? The husband is being assaulted. The wife simply tried to defend her husband. Why does she get punished but the assailant gets away scot-free?
“11When men strive together one with another, and the wife of the one draweth near for to deliver her husband out of the hand of him that smiteth him, and putteth forth her hand, and taketh him by the secrets: 12Then thou shalt cut off her hand, thine eye shall not pity her.”
This does not necessarily describe a situation where one man is passively being attacked by the other and his wife is trying to defend him, which is what you are trying idiotically to claim. Both men could be attacking and striking each other. In which case the law would apply and the woman should not attack the man in this way.
LOL, yes it does you lying snake! It clearly says “deliver her husband out of the hand of him that smiteth him”. What should the wife do? Just stand around? It would be human nature for her to try to protect her husband. But your god does not seem to care about that. Oh no. He’s more interested in protecting the other guy’s jewels rather than the woman’s hand. What kind of idiotic religion do you follow?
“LOL, oh so now it represents a “future” event? Before, you were claiming it was referring to “Biblical history” (again, an oxymoron). Make up your mind, madman.”
No, I said it was something that was real and known to the hearers at the time that the prophecy was given. Not so eschatological as that everything contained in the prophecy is unknown to the hearers.
You’re just trying to make excuses for the clear meaning of the text to avoid admitting how problematic it is for your religion. It’s funny how things become “pictorial” or “metaphorical” when the literal meaning becomes a problem.
Books like Ezekiel and Daniel were written with an eschatological view. They were supposed to be climatic.
The earthly temple itself was always symbolic of heavenly realities so your babble proves nothing.
Apart from that you are always telling us that God does not require sacrifice so Ezekiel is the death knell for Islam which claims that sacrifice is just a form of thanksgiving and almsgiving and nothing more.
More excuses? Ezekiel describes an earthly temple, so your trinitarian babble proves nothing.
And moron, since you can’t seem to get it through your thick head, I don’t believe Ezekiel is scripture! So I couldn’t care less what it says. It’s the death knell for your pagan religion though because it clearly states that the Mosaic law is for all time, and yet it is SCRIPTURE for you. So yeah, you’re screwed. Your religion is finished.
“17And it shall be the prince’s part to give burnt offerings, and meat offerings, and drink offerings, in the feasts, and in the new moons, and in the sabbaths, in all solemnities of the house of Israel: he shall prepare the sin offering, and the meat offering, and the burnt offering, and the peace offerings, to make reconciliation for the house of Israel.”
To make reconciliation for the house of Israel.
That means Moses and all the “islamic” prophets of Israel and all mankind by extension does it not?
It doesn’t matter because Muslims couldn’t care less about what your Bible says. It’s a problem for you. You have no place in the future temple of Ezekiel. You are an uncircumcised pagan. You are not allowed in the temple. Your god rejects you because of that. OUCH!!
It doesn’t matter if you are not persuaded. You are a deceitful pagan, just like the pagans of old. You will cling to your gods and then fall straight into hell on the Day of Judgement.
What matters is that your religion is finished. The evidence is crystal-clear for those with a rational mind. We have no reason to believe in your religion. We reject your blasphemous concept of God and we reject your false apostle Paul.
LOL, and the desperation sets in! When madman fails to explain the contradiction in his own scripture and why Muslims rightly reject the Bible, he has to move the goalpost by talking about the “Quran confirms the Bible” nonsense. You Christians are a hilarious bunch!
Yaqeen institute is doing a very good and impressive job. May Allah (sw) shower His mercy and blessing on them.
Humans are defined as the servants of Allah. And those who are not his servants? Are they also humans?
Seems not to be the case.
Rights are divided under Shariah in to those belonging to Allah and those belonging to his servants. And the rest of us?
Blasphemy and apostasy laws are filtered out of the discussion.
Killing is described as a private matter which Allah does not interfere with and is left to the families to sort out between themselves. This is misleading because it doesn’t deal with the situation of those who are living outside the rule of Shariah and have chosen to reject it as a governing ordinance for their society. Are they fully protected and guaranteed to be safe from all harm even if they have rejected Shariah?
In the bible killing is the destruction of the image of God in man which is a serious offence to God.
Amputation contradicts the law of Moses which never mandates cutting off limbs as reparation for a material loss.
A little video like this presents a rosy picture of Shariah but are we being told the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth about Shariah?
@ madmanna
To begin all humans are God’s property it’s just a matter of are they going to submit to this in this life or the Next:
4:132. Yes, God owns all things whether in the heavens or the earth, and He is enough for those who trust in Him to take care of their affairs.
4:133. If He wished, He could take you away and replace you with others, and He’s certainly capable of doing that.
4:134. So if any pursue the worldly life, the rewards of it and the Next are God’s to give. And He constantly Hears and Sees everything…
If God wishes to punish he can do so however he likes. Even the concept of punishment and blasphemy exist in the Bible:
You have an entire chapter dedicated to Apostasy:
6 “If your brother, the son of your mother, your son or your daughter, the wife [c]of your bosom, or your friend who is as your own soul, secretly entices you, saying, ‘Let us go and serve other gods,’ which you have not known, neither you nor your fathers, 7 of the gods of the people which are all around you, near to you or far off from you, from one end of the earth to the other end of the earth, 8 you shall not [d]consent to him or listen to him, nor shall your eye pity him, nor shall you spare him or conceal him; 9 but you shall surely kill him; your hand shall be first against him to put him to death, and afterward the hand of all the people. 10 And you shall stone him with stones until he dies, because he sought to entice you away from the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, from the house of bondage. 11 So all Israel shall hear and fear, and not again do such wickedness as this among you. (Deuteronomy 13: 6-11)
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Deuteronomy+13&version=NKJV
Also, you can add the Golden Calf incident where they killed all the people who worshipped it.
Now let’s look at blasphemy:
10 Now an Israelite woman’s son, whose father was an Egyptian, went out among the people of Israel. And the Israelite woman’s son and a man of Israel fought in the camp, 11 and the Israelite woman’s son blasphemed the Name, and cursed. Then they brought him to Moses. His mother’s name was Shelomith, the daughter of Dibri, of the tribe of Dan. 12 And they put him in custody, till the will of the Lord should be clear to them.
13 Then the Lord spoke to Moses, saying, 14 “Bring out of the camp the one who cursed, and let all who heard him lay their hands on his head, and let all the congregation stone him. 15 And speak to the people of Israel, saying, Whoever curses his God shall bear his sin. 16 Whoever blasphemes the name of the Lord shall surely be put to death. All the congregation shall stone him. The sojourner as well as the native, when he blasphemes the Name, shall be put to death.
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Leviticus+24%3A10-23&version=ESV
Furthermore not all of Gods laws are universal so the argument regarding Moses’s(as) laws and amputation is irrelevant. God’s laws can change at diffrent times or people for example at one point it was permissable for brother and sister to marry. We wouldn’t say Moses(as) is false because God abrogated this law.
Moving on yes even non Muslims have rights and you read an example in this thread:
https://bloggingtheology2.com/2018/12/30/an-islamophobe-sends-an-email/comment-page-1/#comment-1090
Or if you want to simplify this:
60:8. God has not forbidden you from being kind and acting justly towards those who did not go to war with you over religion, nor kicked you out of your homes because loves those who implement justice.
60:9. God has only forbidden you in regards to those who fought against you on account of your faith, and have driven you out of your homes or helped and supported in your banishment. Whoever makes friends with them, are the ones doing wrong.
Finnally Shariah is divided into civil and religious matters. Non Muslims are not bound by religious matters in Shariah for example, they can sell alcohol to each other, practice their false religions etc. Civil matters would apply to everybody regardless of religion for example traffic laws or anything of that nature which is norml as there’s no society in the world where you can rebel against the state’s laws.
And don’t forget that they should pay a tax on their unbelief. Of course if they were to refuse such an extortion it doesn’t end well. A religion masquerading as a protection racket.
They dont pay tax if they join the army like Muslims do. U are offered a choice: pay tax or join army. Muslims are told to join the army.
So first we had madman, and now have this Isaac clown making idiotic statements based on his ignorance. Any other geniuses with moronic opinions about Sharia?
“Humans are defined as the servants of Allah. And those who are not his servants? Are they also humans?
Seems not to be the case.”
Madman has to move from post to post after he gets embarrassed on a previous post.
Everyone is a servant of Allah (swt), believer and unbeliever. Your idiotic logic is the main reason why you are a laughingstock and no one takes you seriously.
“Amputation contradicts the law of Moses which never mandates cutting off limbs as reparation for a material loss.”
LOL, is this for real? Have you ever read the Bible madman, you lying loser?
“If two men are fighting and the wife of one of them comes to rescue her husband from his assailant, and she reaches out and seizes him by his private parts, you shall cut off her hand. Show her no pity.”
Ooops, now what was that about amputation “contradicting the law of Moses”?
Seriously madman, why haven’t committed yourself to an asylum yet? You don’t belong in the real world with the rest of us.
“If two men are fighting and the wife of one of them comes to rescue her husband from his assailant, and she reaches out and seizes him by his private parts, you shall cut off her hand. Show her no pity.”
Madman crushed.
Faiz: “Ooops, now what was that about amputation “contradicting the law of Moses”? ”
I said material loss, not damage to a human being which is not in the same category. Anything that doesn’t damage the human body itself cannot be compensated for by damaging the human body.
So theft cannot be compensated for by amputation under the law of Moses. This shows that Islam is simply wrong.
Quote “Furthermore not all of Gods laws are universal so the argument regarding Moses’s(as) laws and amputation is irrelevant. God’s laws can change at diffrent times or people for example at one point it was permissable for brother and sister to marry. We wouldn’t say Moses(as) is false because God abrogated this law” End quote
I agree certain laws can be abrogated but in the bible God tells us which. It is not left to us to make the decision.
Laws can only change when the a new covenant is made and this is always with accompanying signs and manifestations of God in the bible.
This simply did not happen as far as Islam was concerned so we know that it cannot be from God.
For example if Allah is the God of Moses who revealed himself and spoke at Sinai why did he remain hidden and silent at the time of Mohammed?
When the new covenant was brought in the church was created with many signs and wonders also.
Quote : Moving on yes even non Muslims have rights and you read an example in this thread:
https://bloggingtheology2.com/2018/12/30/an-islamophobe-sends-an-email/comment-page-1/#comment-1090
Or if you want to simplify this:
60:8. God has not forbidden you from being kind and acting justly towards those who did not go to war with you over religion, nor kicked you out of your homes because loves those who implement justice.” End quote
Non muslims do not have the right to openly proselytize and carry out their religion without let or hindrance under the rule of Sharia. This is an obvious truth.
The punishment of blasphemy and apostasy laws are annuled by the teaching of Jesus. By the creation of the new covenant promised in the OT and fulfilled in the NT, which will remain to the end of the world, Islam would be excluded from having any right to call itself a legal entity with juridical rights before God.
Doing moral or ethical good to a human being is never optional in the bible. A change of the law with no authorization.
The christian is commanded to show love to the peaceful enemy as well as family and friends. This is the teaching of Jesus.
‘The punishment of blasphemy and apostasy laws are annuled by the teaching of Jesus.’
Please show we where Jesus taught this.
“Please show we where Jesus taught this.”
He can’t, of course. Plus, madman basically just decides on a whim which laws are still in effect and which ones are not. He believes that homosexuals should be executed, but not witches. I wonder if he feels that women who touch a man’s private parts while defending their husbands should have their hand chopped off?
poor madman.
“I said material loss, not damage to a human being which is not in the same category. Anything that doesn’t damage the human body itself cannot be compensated for by damaging the human body.”
LOL!! What difference does that make? Your Bible still requires AMPUTATION for a rather mundane crime.
Moreover, Deuteronomy 25 does not say anything about any “damage” to the man’s private parts. Nice try but your heretical attempts to add to the text something that is it not there will not fool anyone.
“If two men are fighting and the wife of one of them comes to rescue her husband from his assailant, and she reaches out and seizes him by his private parts, 12 you shall cut off her hand. Show her no pity.”
See? Nothing there about any “damage”. Stop lying for once, demon.
“So theft cannot be compensated for by amputation under the law of Moses. This shows that Islam is simply wrong.”
No, it just shows that you were embarrassed, which is why you ran off for a few days to lick your wounds. Face it, madman. You are a buffoon.
The Sharia requires amputation for material losses in certain situations. The Mosaic Law, assuming it is legitimate (one can never know for sure when it comes to what the Bible says), requires amputation simply for grabbing a man’s genitals during a fight. This shows how much of a hypocritical idiot you really are.
“I agree certain laws can be abrogated but in the bible God tells us which. It is not left to us to make the decision.”
Actually, you decide on a whim which laws you want to follow. That is the hallmark of a hypocrite. As I have said before, the book of Ezekiel prophecies that the temple will be rebuilt after the battle of Gog and Magog and the temple rites will be reinstated, including the law banning uncircumcised Gentiles from the temple grounds. But you, realizing the uncomfortable position it puts your pagan religion in by proving it false, have to interpret it in nonsensical ways.
“Laws can only change when the a new covenant is made and this is always with accompanying signs and manifestations of God in the bible.
This simply did not happen as far as Islam was concerned so we know that it cannot be from God.”
Actually, it did. There were many signs that Islam is from God. We have miracles. We have prophecies. All of this points to the truth of Islam and the falsehood of pagan Christianity.
“For example if Allah is the God of Moses who revealed himself and spoke at Sinai why did he remain hidden and silent at the time of Mohammed?”
LOL!! He remained hidden to all the prophets, stupid! Even Jesus (pbuh)! Moses (pbuh) was given the special privilege, because that was God’s will.
Also, Muhammad (pbuh) was given the honor of actually speaking with God in the heavens. No one else was given that honor.
“When the new covenant was brought in the church was created with many signs and wonders also.”
Blah, blah, blah. No evidence, of course. The church was an apocalyptic group of desperate people who were convinced the end was coming. It didn’t. Ergo, your phony church was false.
“Non muslims do not have the right to openly proselytize and carry out their religion without let or hindrance under the rule of Sharia. This is an obvious truth.”
LOL, so what? Why would Islamic law allow a pagan to proselytize the worship of false gods? Non-Muslims can practice their religion freely but they cannot try to spread it to Muslims. Islam has self-respect and dignity.
“The punishment of blasphemy and apostasy laws are annuled by the teaching of Jesus. By the creation of the new covenant promised in the OT and fulfilled in the NT, which will remain to the end of the world, Islam would be excluded from having any right to call itself a legal entity with juridical rights before God.”
HAHAHAHA, the pathetic German pagan is trying to project his xenophobic and Euro-centric theology on to the Bible! Why aren’t Christians like Kenny the bootlicker condemning this?
Of course, the book of Revelation says that at the end of time, no religion will have any rights. Either you convert to Christianity or you die. I am not sure how madman can argue for the superiority of Christianity in this regard.
There is no evidence that blasphemy and apostasy laws were “annulled”. Madman can’t produce any evidence from the Bible.
Doing moral or ethical good to a human being is never optional in the bible. A change of the law with no authorization.
The christian is commanded to show love to the peaceful enemy as well as family and friends. This is the teaching of Jesus.”
LOL, so how exactly do you “show love” to a homosexual, since you believe he must be executed? Madman, for the love of God, please commit yourself already!
@ Issac
Wow, where do you live that you can avoid paying taxes because I want to move there?
@ Atlas
Great point I forgot that if they join the military they’re exempt from jizya.
@ Atlas
Also because you reminded me:
– Women and children are excused absolutely
– The disabled, the blind and the elderly, even if they’re rich
– The poor and the insane
– slaves
– A chronically ill-man even if he is rich
– Religious people who keep themselves free for praying and worshipping, i.e. churches, cloisters and oratories
– If a non-Muslim voluntarily participates for military service.
– If the Islamic state becomes unable to protect non-Muslims, then they are legally exonerated from paying the tax. (Ibnul Qayyim, Ahkam Ahlul Dhimma, Volume1, pp.8, 15)
@ Issac
Yeah, a “real” racket has started here. Also, all non-Muslims are eligible for social security when they retire.
@ madmanna
You stated:
“I agree certain laws can be abrogated but in the bible God tells us which. It is not left to us to make the decision.”
I agree to hold onto that thought. Was the Bible written by God? Is it even in the first person? Obviously no it’s someone writing randomly and inserting there own foot notes like Moses was the shyest man on Earth, etc. So you have nothing directly from God just second hand information from people not there.
Laws chang new signs etc.
What is your proof for this claim to begin? In my article, I show God abrogates his law to Moses(as)
https://quranandbibleblog.wordpress.com/2018/04/16/the-concept-of-abrogation-in-scripture/
Next, please show where the Jews came with miracles outside of Moses(as). If you’re using the argument of “his followers performed miracles” so did Muhammad’s(saw) so that makes no sense.
As for your last part, God almost never speaks directly to even prophets (that’s why Moses(as) is considered major) He almost always talks with an intermediary that’s why angels are Messengers.
Next Jesus(as) did not abrogate any of the Torah’s laws according to you and approved of them. Even if you argue that these we’re abrogated God at one point still approved of them so you can’t say they’re morally wrong. Moving on as long as they’re religion is harmful such as killing virgins in the volcano they’re free to practice as they like even govern themselves to their own laws. Now we’re still not going to let them preach they’re evil idolatry to Muslims but among each other do whatever you want.
Finally, you believe that at the end of time Jesus(as) will subdue all the nations under his rule. Whenever Chritians are confronted This writer said it best: “Jesus Loves His Enemies…and Then Kills Them All”
ust as Muhammad’s biography can be divided into a Meccan and Medinan period, so too can Jesus’s lifestory be divided into a First and Second Coming. (Likewise can Moses’ lifestory be divided into pre- and post-Exodus: prior to Exodus, Moses was largely peaceful, but after Exodus, Moses became the leader of the emerging Jewish state–and subsequently engaged in holy wars and even genocide against other nations.) In the First Coming of Christ, only a small segment of society (mostly from the weak and poor) accepted Jesus, whereas the leaders and authorities persecuted him. During this time period, Jesus advised his followers to engage in nonviolent resistance only, perhaps even pacifism. Jesus advised his followers to “love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you.” According to the Bible, this didn’t stop his Jewish and Roman persecutors from crucifying him.
Yet, the Second Coming of Christ is a central theological belief of Christianity. When Jesus returns to earth, the gloves will be off: no longer will he practice nonviolence or pacifism. Enemies will be mercilessly killed, not loved. In this manner, Jesus will fulfill the messianic prophecies found in the Bible–both in the Old and New Testaments.
http://www.loonwatch.com/files/2011/04/jesus-loves-his-enemies-and-then-kills-them-all/
http://www.loonwatch.com/files/2011/05/the-but-thats-just-the-old-testament-cop-out/
http://www.loonwatch.com/files/2011/06/the-but-thats-just-the-old-testament-cop-out-ii-how-the-christian-right-interprets-the-bible/
@Faiz,
Theft alone cannot justify cutting of limbs as it does in Islam. This contradicts the will of God as given through Moses therefore Islam must be a false religion.
Taking hold of a mans scrotum is an attack on the body which is part of the image of God. It is not, as you call it, a mundane act. It violates the sanctity of the image of God in the human body, his creation. The potential damage is very great, whether or not the the real damage is extensive or not.
God manifested his glory and spoke openly and publicly at the giving of covenants and laws in the bible. In the so called revelation of the Koran he cannot do either of these things.
Briefly on apostasy and blasphemy:
Under the old covenant the external force of law and punishment was keeping the Israelites from disobedience and all were under the law by their ethnic relation to Jacob even if they had no personal relationship to God. Israel was a mixture of regenerate and unregenerate.
In the new covenant this external force of law is replaced by the inward working of the spirit of God working through the truth. The gospel filters out those who are chosen, leaving the others free to reject God, and these are indwelt by the spirit of God.
Keeping apostasy and blasphemy laws denies the power of God and the will of God.
‘In the new covenant this external force of law is replaced by the inward working of the spirit of God working through the truth.’ Please show me where Jesus says this.
When I read xtian responses, why do they almost always sound Shakespearean?
Because they are drama queens. Christianity is one big drama, but no substance.
“Theft alone cannot justify cutting of limbs as it does in Islam. This contradicts the will of God as given through Moses therefore Islam must be a false religion.”
LOL, you’re “logic” is ludicrous beyond contempt. Your god would have a woman’s hand cut-off simply for grabbing a man’s genitals. And yet you are complaining about Islam? It makes far more sense to punish a thief for stealing someone’s hard-earned money than to cut-off a woman’s hand for defending her husband. This again just goes to show just how idiotic you Christians are.
“Taking hold of a mans scrotum is an attack on the body which is part of the image of God. It is not, as you call it, a mundane act. It violates the sanctity of the image of God in the human body, his creation. The potential damage is very great, whether or not the the real damage is extensive or not.”
HAHAHAHA, there it is again! Christian logic strikes again! So you think a valid punishment for grabbing a man’s genitals, which you interpret as “an attack on the body which is part of the image of God”, is to…wait for it…cut off the offending hand…which is ironically also “part of the image of God”? WOW!!
Is this the best you can do, you pathetic hypocrite?
“God manifested his glory and spoke openly and publicly at the giving of covenants and laws in the bible. In the so called revelation of the Koran he cannot do either of these things.”
Eh, wrong! When did God speak “openly” when he spoke to Abraham? Who else heard God speak? Who else heard God in the burning bush other than Moses?
“Under the old covenant the external force of law and punishment was keeping the Israelites from disobedience and all were under the law by their ethnic relation to Jacob even if they had no personal relationship to God. Israel was a mixture of regenerate and unregenerate.
In the new covenant this external force of law is replaced by the inward working of the spirit of God working through the truth. The gospel filters out those who are chosen, leaving the others free to reject God, and these are indwelt by the spirit of God.”
Blah, blah, blah. We already know the nonsensical and contradictory Christian BS on this subject. I want you to explain why you choose which laws to follow on a whim. If the “external force of law” has been “replaced”, then on what grounds do you decide that homosexuals should still be executed?
“Keeping apostasy and blasphemy laws denies the power of God and the will of God.”
No, annulling the laws denies the power of God and the will of God. It also exposes the hypocrisy of Christians, who pick and choose which laws to enforce based purely on a whim.
Commit yourself to an insane asylum. I am sure you will feel right at home.
” It makes far more sense to punish a thief for stealing someone’s hard-earned money than to cut-off a woman’s hand for defending her husband.”
It makes no sense to punish the thief by taking away his ability to work and pay off his debt. To mutilate him permanently because of money. This shows how materialistic Islam is. The biblical way is better than the islamic.
“Your god would have a woman’s hand cut-off simply for grabbing a man’s genitals.”
Your attempts to trivialize are only embarrassing you and your religion. Such an attack could at the worst destroy the mans ability to procreate or cause some other lasting damage.
“Eh, wrong! When did God speak “openly” when he spoke to Abraham? Who else heard God speak? Who else heard God in the burning bush other than Moses?”
You admit that “Allah” never spoke to Mohammed while he was on the earth or manifested his glory to him. Also he never did any miracles. At the same time you demand that we believe he was a prophet and we should submit to him? Maybe you should see a psychiatrist?
Also why did the law come in dribs and drabs to your “prophet”, when it was convenient for him?
” I want you to explain why you choose which laws to follow on a whim. If the “external force of law” has been “replaced”, then on what grounds do you decide that homosexuals should still be executed?”
Islam has also added and taken laws away from the law of Moses. By what authority considering that we just have writings based on hearsay that someone was in a cave with the angel Gabriel? Why should any sane person submit to Sharia on that basis?
The ethical and moral law does not change or the punishments for deviation therefrom.
James, Jesus and Paul are one on this.
Blasphemy: ” 10 And whosoever shall speak a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but unto him that blasphemeth against the Holy Ghost it shall not be forgiven. “But now ye also put off all these; anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth.”
Apostasy: I repeat the gospel by its very nature and as taught in the NT implies the right to accept or reject God’s offer of salvation through Jesus Christ and proclaims the power of God to finish salvation through the spirit of God not through force of law.
If Jesus was an islamic prophet why did he let his followers apostasize without threatening them?:
John 6 v 66 From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him. 67 Then said Jesus unto the twelve, Will ye also go away?
@ Erasmus
Let me just go down the line here:
1. Can’t help but notice you glossed over Jesus’s(as) wars in his second coming despite the peace talk in the first. Or what was the Jews evidence for Jesus(as) other than ambiguous meaning stories and what they can argue is magic?
2. So if a woman’s defending her husband from an assault it makes sense to mutilate her for the possibility of what MIGHT happen as opposed to what did lol? This is a deterring punishment and rarely has to be carried out. Also, this law has multiple conditions and is suspended if:
A. Lack of 2 witnesses who saw the event directly.
B. The object doesn’t exceed a certain value
C. The object taken was not locked away
D. There is famine or the person was poor and was stealing to survive
E. The people are related
And it’s not due to “materialism” this is called protecting the rights of others and the economy.
https://bizfluent.com/12078441/how-does-shoplifting-affect-the-economy
https://yourbusiness.azcentral.com/shoplifting-affect-companies-3386.html
I can’t hep but notice that the only people who have a problem with this law are thieves themselves.
3. You never answered who saw God speak to Abraham(as) or defined “God manifested Himself”. But to answer your question yes Muhammads(saw) disciples did see abnormal things during his revelations:
A. Let’s see what ibn Kathir(rh) says about these Qur”an verses:
“…recite the Qur’an calmly and rhythmically with your mind contemplating on its meaning, because I am about to send a heavy Word down on you.” (73:4-5)
“This is similar to what Zayd bin Thabit said. He said, “The Messenger of Allah received some revelation while his thigh was on top of my thigh, and my thigh was almost crushed due to it.”
`A’ishah added, “Verily, I saw him receiving revelation and I noticed the sweat dropping from his forehead on a very cold day as the revelation ended.” This is the wording recorded by Al-Bukhari. Imam Ahmad recorded from `A’ishah that she said, “If the Messenger of Allah received any revelation while he was on his riding animal, it would begin moving its Jiran intensely.” The Jiran is the bottom of the neck. Ibn Jarir chose the interpretation that it (the revelation) is heavy in both ways simultaneously. This is as `Abdur-Rahman bin Zayd bin Aslam said, “Just as it is heavy in this world, it will also be heavy on the Day of Judgement in the Scales.”
http://www.qtafsir.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1457&Itemid=129
B. The Qur’an and Muhammad(saw) don’t even speak the same. If you look at the Prophet’s(saw) speech patterns they are completely different from the Qur’an’s in sentence structure, word choice and emphasis (he(saw) has a tendency when he emphasizes something to mention it three times to the person for example)
C. The Arabs were master poets and they knew something was weird. For you to understand this what I’m going to do is play a major poet by the name of Imru ul Qais. What I want you to do listen for about 15 seconds to the SOUND difference between top of the line Arabic poetry and the Qur’an.
Imru ul Qais:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e7q3oIFcsvE
Quran
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rwPXKbzfqIA
Big difference right? As opposed to previous prophets because Muhammad(saw) had to last to the Day of Judgment the Qur’an is a miracle that is also based of sound not just sight.
“It makes no sense to punish the thief by taking away his ability to work and pay off his debt. To mutilate him permanently because of money. This shows how materialistic Islam is. The biblical way is better than the islamic.”
Your ignorance is showing. Stew already explained what provisions the law provides.
The “Biblical” way is better??? LOL!! Yeah sure, let’s cut off a woman’s hand and let her take care of her children with the one good hand! After all, it was her fault for daring to defend her husband!
“Your attempts to trivialize are only embarrassing you and your religion. Such an attack could at the worst destroy the mans ability to procreate or cause some other lasting damage.”
HAHAHAHA! What a total moron! So, because there “could” be some damage, that automatically warrants chopping her hand off? What if there was no damage, you deranged monkey?
“You admit that “Allah” never spoke to Mohammed while he was on the earth or manifested his glory to him. Also he never did any miracles. At the same time you demand that we believe he was a prophet and we should submit to him? Maybe you should see a psychiatrist?”
Lying again, stupid? He did many miracles. One of them was splitting the moon which is mentioned in the Quran. That was a direct challenge to the unbelievers, who still stubbornly rejected him and dismissed the miracles as “magic”.
“Also why did the law come in dribs and drabs to your “prophet”, when it was convenient for him?”
Why not? When a situation arose, the revelation would come to explain the right course of action. If anything, it proves Muhammad’s sincerity. If he was faking the revelation, he could have tried to give a “one lump sum” revelation, like Joseph Smith.
“Islam has also added and taken laws away from the law of Moses. By what authority considering that we just have writings based on hearsay that someone was in a cave with the angel Gabriel? Why should any sane person submit to Sharia on that basis?”
Answer the question, dummy. Oh what basis do you decide on a whim which laws to follow and which to reject?
We have already refuted and embarrassed you on the proof given for Muhammad’s prophethood. You and your holy spirit are left tongue-tied.
“The ethical and moral law does not change or the punishments for deviation therefrom.”
Blah, blah, blah. Still not answering the question, eh? Why are homosexuals still supposed to be killed, but not witches or apostates?
“Blasphemy: ” 10 And whosoever shall speak a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but unto him that blasphemeth against the Holy Ghost it shall not be forgiven. “But now ye also put off all these; anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth.””
Meaning what? Does the one who blasphemes the holy spirit (which clearly is as confused as you are; oops, did I commit blasphemy??) get put to death?
“Apostasy: I repeat the gospel by its very nature and as taught in the NT implies the right to accept or reject God’s offer of salvation through Jesus Christ and proclaims the power of God to finish salvation through the spirit of God not through force of law.”
LOL, so you have no proof from the “gospel” for your beliefs regarding apostasy? Nice work, hypocrite! You just proved how you pick and choose what you want to believe.
“If Jesus was an islamic prophet why did he let his followers apostasize without threatening them?:
John 6 v 66 From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him. 67 Then said Jesus unto the twelve, Will ye also go away?”
Um because it would have been an empty threat, dummy. Jesus was living under the Roman Empire. He had no power to enforce any law.
But then your mangod did allegedly threaten the churches in Revelation for their blasphemy, didn’t he? He threatened them with the sword…and then failed to follow-up on the threat, which proves that your ludicrous religion is full of hot air.
“The “Biblical” way is better??? LOL!! Yeah sure, let’s cut off a woman’s hand and let her take care of her children with the one good hand! After all, it was her fault for daring to defend her husband!”
This is just a red herring to cite a situation where different laws are weighed against each other. In this case if one law overrides another it does not invalidate the law that is overridden. There are also situations where the law is applied alone.
“What if there was no damage, you deranged monkey?”
It is an attack on the image of God which includes the right and ability of every man to procreate which is punished by a law that is also a deterrent in the wisdom of Jehovah.
“One of them was splitting the moon which is mentioned in the Quran. That was a direct challenge to the unbelievers, who still stubbornly rejected him and dismissed the miracles as “magic”.”
LOL, of no use to mankind along with all the time consuming rituals, and the others, what were they?
“11And the Israelitish woman’s son blasphemed the name of the LORD, and cursed. And they brought him unto Moses: (and his mother’s name was Shelomith, the daughter of Dibri, of the tribe of Dan:) 12And they put him in ward, that the mind of the LORD might be shewed them.
13And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, 14Bring forth him that hath cursed without the camp; and let all that heard him lay their hands upon his head, and let all the congregation stone him.”
If Islam can recreate this framework to operate the law of blasphemy it is authorized to do so but it cannot because it never had anything to do with it in the first place.
“He threatened them with the sword”?
Twisting scripture as usual.
The immediate context of the rebuilding of the temple in Ezekiel is obviously the rebuilding which followed after the exile. Prophets firstly address the situation in which God’s people find themselves, not some far off future scenario.
“This is just a red herring to cite a situation where different laws are weighed against each other. In this case if one law overrides another it does not invalidate the law that is overridden. There are also situations where the law is applied alone.”
How is a red herring, stupid? Your Bible says to cut off the woman’s hand. How would she be expected to care for the children with one hand? Your silly “logic” has come back to bite you and you are now left tongue-tied.
“It is an attack on the image of God which includes the right and ability of every man to procreate which is punished by a law that is also a deterrent in the wisdom of Jehovah.”
LOL!! So your god has a penis then?
Isn’t the woman’s hand also made in the image of God?
Your god’s “wisdom” was clearly very short-sighted. And you still haven’t answered the question. What if there was no damage, you deranged monkey? Would her hand be cut off?
“LOL, of no use to mankind along with all the time consuming rituals, and the others, what were they?”
LOL, so now that you have been refute again, you move the goalpost, eh? Such a good little Christian monkey! So now miracles have to be of some use? So I guess Moses’ snake miracle was of use, huh? LOL, is there even an ounce of login and reason in your diseased mind?
You want more miracles? Certainly, my dear!
Jabir reported: My father had died in debt. So I came to the Prophet and said, “My father (died) leaving unpaid debts, and I have nothing except the yield of his date palms; and their yield for many years will not cover his debts. So please come with me, so that the creditors may not misbehave with me.” The Prophet went round one of the heaps of dates and invoked (Allah), and then did the same with another heap and sat on it and said, “Measure (for them).” He paid them their rights and what remained was as much as had been paid to them.
`Abdullah reported: We used to consider miracles as Allah’s Blessings, but you people consider them to be a warning. Once we were with Allah’s Messenger on a journey, and we ran short of water. He said, “Bring the water remaining with you.” The people brought a utensil containing a little water. He placed his hand in it and said, “Come to the blessed water, and the Blessing is from Allah.” I saw the water flowing from among the fingers of Allah’s Messenger, and no doubt, we heard the meal glorifying Allah, when it was being eaten (by him). (Reported by al-Bukhari)
So there you go. Miracles that were of use and benefited the people. Madman gets crushed again!
“If Islam can recreate this framework to operate the law of blasphemy it is authorized to do so but it cannot because it never had anything to do with it in the first place.”
Still not answering the question? Your idiotic ramblings aside, I am still waiting for you to answer my questions. On what basis do you decide on a whim what laws to follow and what laws to ignore?
“Twisting scripture as usual.”
Not at all, silly billy. Just because you say so doesn’t make it so. How did I “twist” your pathetic “scripture”? Didn’t your mangod threaten the churches for their blasphemous practices?
Speaking of “twisting scripture”, we have this little nugget from madman:
“The immediate context of the rebuilding of the temple in Ezekiel is obviously the rebuilding which followed after the exile. Prophets firstly address the situation in which God’s people find themselves, not some far off future scenario.”
Except that it explicitly puts it in an apocalyptic context. The battle of Gog and Magog was the context. When did this battle occur after the exile was over? Your so-called “prophets” were short-sighted and made false prophecies which disprove your scripture as a man-made book which no reasonable person will follow. I guess that explains why you follow it. LOL!!!
“Isn’t the woman’s hand also made in the image of God?”
She would be a fool for breaking it and allowing herself to become a deterrent to others.
“What if there was no damage, you deranged monkey?
If the law is a deterrent it prevents future damage by deterring this form of attack.
“So there you go. Miracles that were of use and benefited the people. Madman gets crushed again!”
Water flowing from between his fingers. Lol, What was the guy smoking that dreamt that up?
Those who commit blasphemy themselves by their pagan practices are elevating themselves to adjudicate over and punish others for blasphemy, what irony and impertinence!
The blasphemy law was in the context of the Israelite theocracy with the real Shekinah presence of God where God himself delivered the final verdict through some means of communication which is one reason why Islam cannot administer this law, even if it had the right to, which it doesn’t.
“Except that it explicitly puts it in an apocalyptic context. The battle of Gog and Magog was the context. When did this battle occur after the exile was over?”
It must have happened that Meschech and Tubal were one of the many invading powers that invaded Israel before Jerusalem was finally destroyed by the babylonian empire. So Gog and Magog are rooted in biblical history.
Madman is here for his weekly dose of embarrassment.
“She would be a fool for breaking it and allowing herself to become a deterrent to others.”
So still not answering the question. I think you realize you are stuck in a conundrum. Your book is contradictory. Apparently your god put more value on a man’s genitals than a woman’s hand, so much so that he was willing to contradict himself on the whole creating man in his image business. WOW!!
“If the law is a deterrent it prevents future damage by deterring this form of attack.”
The law can’t prevent a crime of passion, stupid. In a momentary lapse of judgement, such as a situation where her husband is being attacked, a woman could react in such a way without even thinking. Your god would have her punished for simply defending her husband. That’s not a deterrent. That’s unjust.
Now, the law of cutting the hand of a thief is a true deterrent. However, the wisdom of the law allows for extenuating circumstances, as stew already explained. No such wisdom is found in the Biblical law. I have a hard time believing this was an actual law given by God.
“Water flowing from between his fingers. Lol, What was the guy smoking that dreamt that up?”
LOL, I think I see madman’s strategy. Every time you get humiliated, you move the goalpost. Hmm, let’s see the “logical” miracles found in the Bible: raising the dead (yep, that happens everyday), multiplying fish for people to eat (oh look, someone must have been on drugs to come up with that one!), parting the sea, turning a rod into a snake (well, at least it wasn’t a talking snake like in Genesis!). I guess they were all smoking something, eh madman? Seriously, when will you commit yourself to an asylum?
“Those who commit blasphemy themselves by their pagan practices are elevating themselves to adjudicate over and punish others for blasphemy, what irony and impertinence!”
Bwwahahahha! A trinitarian pagan manworshiper is complaining about “blasphemy” from others. What irony and impertinence!
“The blasphemy law was in the context of the Israelite theocracy with the real Shekinah presence of God where God himself delivered the final verdict through some means of communication which is one reason why Islam cannot administer this law, even if it had the right to, which it doesn’t.”
Still no proof from the scriptures! Madman just keeps babbling on with his personal opinions, but cannot bring a single verse from his so-called “scripture” to prove his point.
And moron, once again, Ezekiel refutes you. The presence of God is supposed to return to the temple:
“he glory of the Lord entered the temple through the gate facing east. 5 Then the Spirit lifted me up and brought me into the inner court, and the glory of the Lord filled the temple.” (Ezekiel 43:4-5)
Man, Ezekiel is a thorn in the side of Christianity! LOL!!
“It must have happened that Meschech and Tubal were one of the many invading powers that invaded Israel before Jerusalem was finally destroyed by the babylonian empire. So Gog and Magog are rooted in biblical history.”
Oy vei! The lies just never stop coming out of madman’s mouth! There was no battle that ended in the defeat of the invading powers, you fool! And you know it, yet you still insist on these pathetic lies to save your religion. That is the true nature of a kafir, one who hides the truth even though he knows it!
So tell me madman. At what point in “Biblical history” (talk about an oxymoron) were Gog and Magog defeated as described in Ezekiel? When did the following happen:
“When Gog attacks the land of Israel, my hot anger will be aroused, declares the Sovereign Lord. 19 In my zeal and fiery wrath I declare that at that time there shall be a great earthquake in the land of Israel. 20 The fish in the sea, the birds in the sky, the beasts of the field, every creature that moves along the ground, and all the people on the face of the earth will tremble at my presence. The mountains will be overturned, the cliffs will crumble and every wall will fall to the ground. 21 I will summon a sword against Gog on all my mountains, declares the Sovereign Lord. Every man’s sword will be against his brother. 22 I will execute judgment on him with plague and bloodshed; I will pour down torrents of rain, hailstones and burning sulfur on him and on his troops and on the many nations with him.”
This talks of earthquakes, mountains being overturned, plagues and torrents of rain and hailstone. Sounds apocalyptic, doesn’t it?
This disproves Christianity. Either it was supposed to happen thousands of years ago, in which case it would be a false prophecy (and thus both Judaism and Christianity are false religions) OR it is supposed to happen in the future, in which case Christianity is a false religion, but not necessarily Judaism. So Christians are screwed either way. Your religion falls apart because of a few chapters in an apocalyptic book. Hallelujah!
“such as a situation where her husband is being attacked, a woman could react in such a way without even thinking. ”
God does not want the man to be attacked in this way so the woman should think first. We are not animals.
some people are animals.
Who would you have in mind Paul?
guess
Then your god is a fool. Men’s genitals are more important to him than a woman’s hand.
And thank you for admitting that there is no gender equality in the Bible. Men and women are treated differently according to the law.
Faiz:
“Still no proof from the scriptures! Madman just keeps babbling on with his personal opinions, but cannot bring a single verse from his so-called “scripture” to prove his point.”
Here’s the proof:
“11And the Israelitish woman’s son blasphemed the name of the LORD, and cursed. And they brought him unto Moses: (and his mother’s name was Shelomith, the daughter of Dibri, of the tribe of Dan:) 12And they put him in ward, that the mind of the LORD might be shewed them.
13And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, 14Bring forth him that hath cursed without the camp; and let all that heard him lay their hands upon his head, and let all the congregation stone him.”
Until Allah can speak Muslims have no right to administer their so-called “blasphemy” laws.
HAHAHAHA, I asked for proof of your idiotic assertion that blasphemy is no longer a punishable crime. This only further tightens the screws on Christianity. Ezekiel claims that God’s presence will enter the temple. This has yet to happen. Ergo, Christianity is a false religion since the law is supposed to be re-established.
And by the way idiot, God spoke to Moses (pbuh), but He spoke to other prophets as well either through visions or a messenger. Also, God spoke directly to Muhammad (pbuh) as well. So you’re silly claim is refuted once again.
I noticed you are increasing your weekly dose of embarrassment. Bravo!
“This disproves Christianity.”
Pathetic nonsense.
Gog was a prince of Meschech and Tubal at the same time as the babylonians were in the ascendency and God used Babylon to punish these and other nations at the time.
This does not rule out Ezekiel using these judgements to describe judgments that will happen in the future similarily to Jesus in Matthew 25.
How does that disprove the bible or christianity?
LOL, oh so now it represents a “future” event? Before, you were claiming it was referring to “Biblical history” (again, an oxymoron). Make up your mind, madman.
If it is referring to the future, it disproves Christianity and your false apostle Paul since Ezekiel claims that the temple will be rebuilt and the Mosaic law re-instituted. What have we been talking about all this time, dummy?
This refutes the nonsense of Christianity.
More likely it is a pictorial representation of the heavenly jerusalem which does not require a literal fulfilment.
More likely it is a literal representation of the future Jerusalem which does not require a pictorial fulfilment. A pictorial fulfilment would not need the minute details that are given in the book. Give it up. Your religion is finished.
“such as a situation where her husband is being attacked, a woman could react in such a way without even thinking. Your god would have her punished for simply defending her husband. That’s not a deterrent. That’s unjust.”
And if the situation is the other way round, what then? Both the husband and her man are the attackers?
Oy vei! That’s your Bible’s problem because it doesn’t explain if the situation was reversed. That is further proof that it is a man-made document. Man’s laws are vague and need to be constantly updated. God’s laws are eternally wise. This leads me to believe that the law in Deuteronomy 25 was not one of God’s actual laws, or it was more specific but has been edited over time.
Read carefully what your Bible says, silly madman. It is describing a situation where the husband is being assaulted:
“If two men are fighting and the wife of one of them comes to rescue her husband from his assailant”
See? The husband is being assaulted. The wife simply tried to defend her husband. Why does she get punished but the assailant gets away scot-free?
“11When men strive together one with another, and the wife of the one draweth near for to deliver her husband out of the hand of him that smiteth him, and putteth forth her hand, and taketh him by the secrets: 12Then thou shalt cut off her hand, thine eye shall not pity her.”
This does not necessarily describe a situation where one man is passively being attacked by the other and his wife is trying to defend him, which is what you are trying idiotically to claim. Both men could be attacking and striking each other. In which case the law would apply and the woman should not attack the man in this way.
LOL, yes it does you lying snake! It clearly says “deliver her husband out of the hand of him that smiteth him”. What should the wife do? Just stand around? It would be human nature for her to try to protect her husband. But your god does not seem to care about that. Oh no. He’s more interested in protecting the other guy’s jewels rather than the woman’s hand. What kind of idiotic religion do you follow?
“LOL, oh so now it represents a “future” event? Before, you were claiming it was referring to “Biblical history” (again, an oxymoron). Make up your mind, madman.”
No, I said it was something that was real and known to the hearers at the time that the prophecy was given. Not so eschatological as that everything contained in the prophecy is unknown to the hearers.
You’re just trying to make excuses for the clear meaning of the text to avoid admitting how problematic it is for your religion. It’s funny how things become “pictorial” or “metaphorical” when the literal meaning becomes a problem.
Books like Ezekiel and Daniel were written with an eschatological view. They were supposed to be climatic.
The earthly temple itself was always symbolic of heavenly realities so your babble proves nothing.
Apart from that you are always telling us that God does not require sacrifice so Ezekiel is the death knell for Islam which claims that sacrifice is just a form of thanksgiving and almsgiving and nothing more.
More excuses? Ezekiel describes an earthly temple, so your trinitarian babble proves nothing.
And moron, since you can’t seem to get it through your thick head, I don’t believe Ezekiel is scripture! So I couldn’t care less what it says. It’s the death knell for your pagan religion though because it clearly states that the Mosaic law is for all time, and yet it is SCRIPTURE for you. So yeah, you’re screwed. Your religion is finished.
“17And it shall be the prince’s part to give burnt offerings, and meat offerings, and drink offerings, in the feasts, and in the new moons, and in the sabbaths, in all solemnities of the house of Israel: he shall prepare the sin offering, and the meat offering, and the burnt offering, and the peace offerings, to make reconciliation for the house of Israel.”
To make reconciliation for the house of Israel.
That means Moses and all the “islamic” prophets of Israel and all mankind by extension does it not?
It doesn’t matter because Muslims couldn’t care less about what your Bible says. It’s a problem for you. You have no place in the future temple of Ezekiel. You are an uncircumcised pagan. You are not allowed in the temple. Your god rejects you because of that. OUCH!!
You forget one thing: we don’t believe in it. It’s NOT OUR scripture. It’s yours. No amount of rethoric will change that.
Exactly, but the dummy doesn’t get that.
“It doesn’t matter because Muslims couldn’t care less about what your Bible says. It’s a problem for you.”
“You forget one thing: we don’t believe in it. It’s NOT OUR scripture. It’s yours. No amount of rethoric will change that.”
I’m glad its my scripture and not yours, and NO I don’t have a problem with it and you have brought no arguments forward to persuade me otherwise.
It doesn’t matter if you are not persuaded. You are a deceitful pagan, just like the pagans of old. You will cling to your gods and then fall straight into hell on the Day of Judgement.
What matters is that your religion is finished. The evidence is crystal-clear for those with a rational mind. We have no reason to believe in your religion. We reject your blasphemous concept of God and we reject your false apostle Paul.
It seems you also reject the book that your prophet said was given by Allah.
LOL, and the desperation sets in! When madman fails to explain the contradiction in his own scripture and why Muslims rightly reject the Bible, he has to move the goalpost by talking about the “Quran confirms the Bible” nonsense. You Christians are a hilarious bunch!